Tiniest Hymer Promaster Carrado/Axion

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by avanti

let's not forget the minimalists:

the winner

[wincrasher]

Talk about nonsense!

Tanks burp. All of them do it. I'd rather not have a tank full of **** and piss burping up my shower drain or kitchen sink drain. I'll bet real money that the stench is far greater than the soapy water that usually resides in my gray tank.

Eventually you will be over-full. It will back up your shower drain most likely. It will also foul the dry trap you have on that drain with the chunks of sewage that will clog it. That item will most likely need to be pulled and cleaned or replaced.

The not being able to flush your sewer hose is simply gross. I believe that van has a macerator pump out? If so, you'll need to fill your tank with water to clean it out and then pump it out - once may be enough, twice more likely. Don't think that van has a tank flusher, so you are looking at either holding the foot lever on your toilet tank down for 21 gallons, or dragging a hose inside to stick down a drain, or connecting to city water and running the tap. Whatever method, it's a PITA and will piss people off who are waiting behind you at a dump station.

As far as savings goes, I'd give a side-eye to that claim. Plastic tanks are cheap. You'd still need to run pipe and fitting for the toilet drain over to where this tank resides - or run from the gray sources over to where the combined tank is - that's fittings and labor that aren't free. So at best, it's probably a wash.

[avanti]

Originally Posted by wincrasher

Talk about nonsense!

Yes, total nonsense.

Sewage check valves are readily available and work properly. My tanks don't "burp" -- ever.

I do agree that if I had a gravity dump I would want to be able to flush. But I also think it is insane not to have a permanently installed, sealed macerator system, which has no need whatsoever of rinsing.

Two tanks make zero sense.

EDIT:
By the way, many (probably most) rigs have the bathroom sink drain into the black tank both to save plumbing and to have at least a little bit of badly needed water in the tank. Has anyone had any of these awful things happen with them?

[wincrasher]

LOL. You are getting funny now.

Anything that is rolling down the road will have it's tanks occasionally burb. It happens, I've experienced it and won't argue with you about it.

We are talking about the cheapest Roadtrek/Hymer product. I'm sure the macerator system isn't the best, nor are Hymer's plumbing practices as demonstrated in other threads. Without flushing, the macerator and the discharge hose will have chunks of crap and paper in it. Don't know what you are talking about that it will need no cleaning. I regularly have to clean the one on my boat with additional flushes or it will cake up.

There are numerous benefits to having separate tanks. Despite your claims, some folks do occasionally dump their gray on the ground. Done responsibly it's fine. Odor control as I've indicated above. Cleaning sewer hose is another. It saves water ultimately as you are using alot less fresh water for flushing.

As far as Interstate having a shared tank - it isn't surprising. Airstream still uses the practice on their Bambi's and their new cheaper trailer (Nest?). They do it for space constraints if anything. Why they chose to do it on their B vans is a boggle, but it's not above them to do cost cutting or cutting corners to save labor. They are Thor after all.

[Davydd]

I think the RV Class B industry has spoken with their collective experience with a separate black and grey tank. That's an industry that has to cut corners anyway they can. If a combined tank was better they would do it.

I have a 18 gal. black tank and a separate 26 gal. grey tank for a total of 44 gal. I question whether you can get that volume in a single tank in a van. If you possibly could it might limit where you design and place the bathroom in the van.

You can experience for yourself. Fill a black tank with poop and toilet paper and then empty your grey tank first and black tank second and judge the results.

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by wincrasher

LOL. …………….. I'm sure the macerator system isn't the best, nor are Hymer's plumbing practices as demonstrated in other threads. Without flushing, the macerator and the discharge hose will have chunks of crap and paper in it. Don't know what you are talking about that it will need no cleaning. I regularly have to clean the one on my boat with additional flushes or it will cake up.
………………………...

If macerator pump is not cleaned from solids or paper its flexible impeller can take set and pump will lose its pumping capability. I remember it well from my boating days.

[avanti]

Originally Posted by GeorgeRa

If macerator pump is not cleaned from solids or paper its flexible impeller can take set and pump will lose its pumping capability. I remember it well from my boating days.

Well, mine lasted a decade with zero attention. Despite what some tried to argue last time around, the solids DO drain first. I'm sorry I didn't take a movie.

The claim that two tanks are more space efficient is beyond ridiculous.

I have lived for extensive periods with both setups. I would go back to a single tank in a heartbeat.

[BBQ]

.

The Winnebago Travato 59K bathroom sink drains into the black tank.

Yes people have complained about foul smells... because the water in the trap evaporated, which can be expected from RVs that sit most of the time.

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by BBQ

.

The Winnebago Travato 59K bathroom sink drains into the black tank.

Yes people have complained about foul smells... because the water in the trap evaporated, which can be expected from RVs that sit most of the time.

We have an apartment which is vacant for 9 months per year. Our method to prevent foul smell of dried out toilet is adding about ¼” thick layer of vegetable oil. After 9-month oil is darker but there is no foul odor, one flush and it is like we have never left.

[BBQ]

Originally Posted by GeorgeRa

We have an apartment which is vacant for 9 months per year. Our method to prevent foul smell of dried out toilet is adding about ¼” thick layer of vegetable oil. After 9-month oil is darker but there is no foul odor, one flush and it is like we have never left.

That is smart.

I should do the same; I have a shower stall in the guest room that seldom get used. I should just add some oil to the drain. Thanks.

[mumkin]

Originally Posted by GeorgeRa

We have an apartment which is vacant for 9 months per year. Our method to prevent foul smell of dried out toilet is adding about ¼” thick layer of vegetable oil. After 9-month oil is darker but there is no foul odor, one flush and it is like we have never left.

What I do is remove most of the water in the bowl... fill a large freezer zipper style bag with water... and put it in the bowl. When I get home, I just open the zipper and pour the water in the bowl. I do the same with sandwich size baggies over all the drains.

No smells, no creatures sneaking in through the plumbing.

[gregmchugh]

Originally Posted by BBQ

That is smart.

I should do the same; I have a shower stall in the guest room that seldom get used. I should just add some oil to the drain. Thanks.

Don’t use mineral oil even though you see that recommended at times. I used it at our house when we were gone for six months and it was not good at the cast iron drain connections that used rubber seals.

[gregmchugh]

Originally Posted by gregmchugh

Welcome fans, we are here at the Forum for a no holds barred debate. In the far corner is the two tank team and in the near corner is the one tank team. At the Bell come out with your best shots. After twelve rounds we will have a decision unless there is a knockout...

Ding...

Update after round 1, I don’t think there is a clear winner and no apparent knockout with both sides still in action...

It is a challenge for the one tank side being outnumbered by the the two tankers and we will see what happens next...

[GeorgeRa]

In sincere effort of trying to separate my love affair emotions for Cassettes I would prefer 2 tanks because from my unbiased perspective they are better. Why better should you ask, because I say so.

[MsNomer]

When I brush my teeth, I spit into my bagged bucket. Does that count?

[wincrasher]

The Travato K bath sink drain has a traditional water trap before it goes to the black tank. It's probably a better choice than the dry traps for the kitchen sink and shower drains that go to the gray. Probably a better choice for rolling down the road so that something remains to block any gassing.

[silex840]

Since we are on the stinky subject, does anyone know the proper way to use the dump hose? There is a reducer attached to the end and I wasn’t sure when to uncap the smaller end versus the whole thing to get more flow.

Originally Posted by silex840

Hey guys so random thought. My other vehicle besides the Axion is a Nissan Leaf all electric car with a 24kWh lithium battery pack. Is there a way to wire the 12v@100A car battery off the Leaf to one of the lithium power switches in order to power the coach? Would this require reprogramming the built-in 2000W pure sine wave interver?

Or does it make more sense to use a 1500W inverter (pure sine wave even necessary?) off the car battery to get the 120VAC@15A with the shore power cord connected? This would be done while stationary of course. The ultimate goal would be to charge up the coach battery while still being able to draw power as needed which I wasn’t sure if it was possible with the first suggestion with a direct connection.

Reposting because someone has to more familiar than I with the electrics.

[kite_rider]

Originally Posted by silex840

Since we are on the stinky subject, does anyone know the proper way to use the dump hose? There is a reducer attached to the end and I wasn’t sure when to uncap the smaller end versus the whole thing to get more flow.

Reposting because someone has to more familiar than I with the electrics.

I've always removed the larger black cap off the hose so it connects directly to a typical RV dump station. You don't want any nasty stuff to get clogged up in the smaller hose connector opening if you can avoid it.

Regarding your Leaf car question; you should clarify a few things. Are you trying to charge the coach battery while out camping somewhere when normal external power is not available? Are you actually trying to use power from the high voltage lithium pack in the car? The easiest way to charge the coach battery when you are away from utility connection is to simply start the engine on the Axion.

[kite_rider]

Good discussion on the single/dual tank systems for a Class B. This single tank system with a macerator is new to me so I'm holding off judgement for now.

There are a few things I can say about the implementation on the Axion though.

1. There are occasional smells. I notice most of them up at the plumbing vents that are on the roof (right and left side near the back of the van). I think this odor is getting into the van through the open doors and windows. So far the best solution has been to have the proper amount of toilet chemical in the tank. That seems to neutralize the odors which are pretty slight in the first place.

2. All of the plumbing traps on the van have a threaded cleanout cap on the bottom of the bend. While working on a couple things I've put a bucket under the trap and removed the cap and then run some clean water in the drain. It seems to remove the stuff that has built up in the trap.

3. There is a "feature" on the macerating toilet that will not let it flush if it thinks the tank is full. This has been an occasional problem since the sensors sometimes read 'full' when the tank isn't full. Any suggestions on a good way to clean these sensors would be appreciated. I might also try to defeat this feature by rigging one of the sensor wires in such a way that it doesn't read 'full'.

4. I'm pretty worried about the macerator pump freezing and breaking in the winter. The exit hose is straight up out of the pump and then across the rear axle to the drain hose. Seems like waste water will get stuck in there and possibly freeze and maybe break the pump. Anybody have experience with this and a possible solution? I can only think about pouring in some RV antifreeze after draining the tank and pumping some of it into the macerator pump.

5. One kind of interesting thing about this macerator pump is that I've been able to drain my tank into a laundry sink in my garage after a short trip. I've never done this when having "#2" in the tank; just sink water and "#1" from the toilet. I just zip tie the drain hose to the faucet on the sink, run the fresh water on full, and pump away. I've been able to see what comes out in the process. The pump always pumps out the dirtiest water right at first, the water coming out near the end of the cycle is pretty clean. The only 'solid' thing I've ever seen come out of the hose is coffee grounds. Everything else has always been liquid. Again though, I'm very careful to dump each tank with #2 into a regular RV dump station. But I'm starting to think that the two macerators (one at the toilet and the other at the tank drain) do a pretty good job of liquifying whatever goes into the tank and I may start pumping a tank with chemically treated #2 into the utility sink. I'm also starting to think about a plumbing modification to my laundry sink to enable a direct connection of the sewer hose so it doesn't have to dump through the sink. Anyway, just thought I would throw that out there as well...

[kmrotterdam]

I'm stumped: I park at a spot with a 20 amp dedicated house-hold outlet. (I own an Axion with EcoTrek 400). In the past, I used an extension cord with an adapter, so I wouldn't have to take out the heavy RV cord, and it worked fine. But just recently, the van stopped recognizing the extension cord with adapter. I checked the cord, used a different one, tried two other adapters and nothing. BUT, if I use the original RV cord that came with the van and use a 15 amp adapter with the SAME extension cord and outlet, it works fine! What's going on???