Cost of ownership: passenger Ford Transit vs. Mercedes Benz Sprinter

[Flounce]

Hi,

Context:

My wife is a soccer mom and spends large amounts of time - hours - on weekdays transporting the kids to various classes and events, and waiting in the car for them. We currently have a minivan, a Honda Odyssey. We plan on getting a mid roof car like Ford Transit or Sprinter and add a sink and toilet to the back, maybe some nicer bucket seats in the back.

Question:

My wife wants the Sprinter because it is fancier than the Ford Sprinter. I don't mind paying an extra 10-15K up front but I am more concerned about 1) maintenance costs and 2) cost of repairs and reliability.

Is there some consensus on whether the Sprinter is a lot more expensive to own than the Ford Transit? Will routine maintenance cost more per year, and how much more? Is the Transit more reliable than the Sprinter? Does it cost a lot more to repair the MB Sprinter?

Thank you.

[LosAngeles]

Originally Posted by Flounce

Hi,

Context:

My wife is a soccer mom and spends large amounts of time - hours - on weekdays transporting the kids to various classes and events, and waiting in the car for them. We currently have a minivan, a Honda Odyssey. We plan on getting a mid roof car like Ford Transit or Sprinter and add a sink and toilet to the back, maybe some nicer bucket seats in the back.

Question:

My wife wants the Sprinter because it is fancier than the Ford Sprinter. I don't mind paying an extra 10-15K up front but I am more concerned about 1) maintenance costs and 2) cost of repairs and reliability.

Is there some consensus on whether the Sprinter is a lot more expensive to own than the Ford Transit? Will routine maintenance cost more per year, and how much more? Is the Transit more reliable than the Sprinter? Does it cost a lot more to repair the MB Sprinter?

Thank you.

FYI it is a Ford Transit, not Ford Sprinter.

Multiple smart (industry) people have told me that without question... the cost of owning a MB Sprinter van is more for parts than a Ford Transit van.

Plus keep in mind only some MB places will service a MB Sprinter. They can be hard to find.

plus a Sprinter costs more up front.

plus many people have had problems with the Diesel Sprinters..... gas only is available for a Sprinter in 2019, supposedly....

just my 2c.

[avanti]

Originally Posted by LosAngeles

Plus keep in mind only some MB places will service a MB Sprinter.

To be fair, only some Ford dealers will service Transits. Probably not quite as scarce as Sprinter dealers, though.

I agree with your conclusion, however.

[jon]

Originally Posted by LosAngeles

FYI it is a Ford Transit, not Ford Sprinter.

plus many people have had problems with the Diesel Sprinters..... gas only is available for a Sprinter in 2019, supposedly....

just my 2c.

I bought a sprinter for use similar to what you describe. It can have two passenger seat rows or one seat row and a dinette bench/bed. I use it during the week to haul kids for the wife's after school program at her day care. Bathroom, sink, microwave, and fridge in the back.
I've had a lot of problems with the diesel emissions and now that the dealer has fixed the problems finally it seems to be running well. I have since learned that if I drive locally or idle often I should drive at freeway speeds for over a half an hour to burn the "soot" off every week or so.
If you plan to drive on the freeway mostly then diesel is the preferred engine, but if city driving and idling are planned gas is the way to go.

That's my opinion.

[Roadtrek Adventuous RS1]

Originally Posted by Flounce

Hi,

Context:

My wife is a soccer mom and spends large amounts of time - hours - on weekdays transporting the kids to various classes and events, and waiting in the car for them. We currently have a minivan, a Honda Odyssey. We plan on getting a mid roof car like Ford Transit or Sprinter and add a sink and toilet to the back, maybe some nicer bucket seats in the back.

Question:

My wife wants the Sprinter because it is fancier than the Ford Sprinter. I don't mind paying an extra 10-15K up front but I am more concerned about 1) maintenance costs and 2) cost of repairs and reliability.

Is there some consensus on whether the Sprinter is a lot more expensive to own than the Ford Transit? Will routine maintenance cost more per year, and how much more? Is the Transit more reliable than the Sprinter? Does it cost a lot more to repair the MB Sprinter?

Thank you.

First thing to decide is whether your considering the gasoline or diesel Ford Transit? Yes, only the 2019 Mercedes Benz comes in both gasoline and diesel versions, confirmed.

I test drove a Ford Transit 3.2 inline FIVE cylinder.. I was not impressed, but, you might like it. I did not test drive the gasoline version.

One thing you need to know is Mercedes Benz vehicles are going to cost more... WHY? Well, they're from Germany and the parts are mostly imported. Plus, their mechanics probably charge a higher hourly rate.

You really have to test drive the two vehicles and decide which one you like better.

Sounds like you're going to outfit this van yourself as opposed to buying a conversion, that's fine.. you have choices.

We were looking at a Winnebago Fuse ( it was on the Ford Transit 350 platform) when I found the Roadtrek RS Adventurous and liked it a lot more.

The 3.2 Five has a slightly larger displacement than the 3.0 V6 Mercedes. Completely different feel and response to the two engines.

Again, that's what choices are all about.... Good luck.

[rockymtnb]

Originally Posted by Flounce

...My wife is a soccer mom and spends large amounts of time - hours - on weekdays transporting the kids to various classes and events, and waiting in the car for them. We currently have a minivan, a Honda Odyssey. We plan on getting a mid roof car like Ford Transit or Sprinter and add a sink and toilet to the back, maybe some nicer bucket seats in the back.

First off as a Sprinter owner, Yes the maintenance costs will be somewhat higher. Just a fact of life with Mercedes. We have a good independent Sprinter shop (Linden Engineering) which helps keep costs under control.

But a couple other items stand out in your comments. The soccer mom local transport and waiting in the vehicle tasks should point toward a gas engine over diesel, which excels for long haul transport efficiency. For a Sprinter that means waiting for the 2019 gas engine model. Transit already has a couple good gas engine options.

The family vehicle loaded with kids should make safety a priority, and Mercedes puts more effort into occupant passive and active safety than any of the other van manufacturers. Also, if you need a crew van version with a row of factory installed passenger seating and open cargo space behind for sink/toilet/storage conversion that's only available in the Sprinter.

Finally, since it sounds like your wife will be spending a lot of time in this van, make sure she's comfortable with the driving position and ergonomics. Sprinter provides a higher driving position that requires a bit more of a step up to the drivers seat. Transit has a lower seat that many find easier to slide into, but not quite the commanding roadway view of the Sprinter. Those items are personal preference and the 'Happy Wife, Happy Life' rule probably applies.

[LosAngeles]

all good thoughts.

good thread

[Roadtrek Adventuous RS1]

Originally Posted by LosAngeles

all good thoughts.

good thread

Diesel engines love to be driven at highway speeds.... stop and go traffic is fine shorter term, but, diesel engines are known for being a long distance runner.... there's a diesel particulate filter that needs to be "regenerated"... every couple of weeks by running the engine for 30 minutes or so at 55 to 60 MPH......it keeps the system running better....

You really don't want that diesel sitting around for super long periods of time.....

There's lots of videos everywhere on this... just Google diesel particulate filter and maintenance.......

Diesel engines are great... very repsonsive and not at all like the "old diesels" you probably remember... but, they are going to be more finicky.... Longer service intervals but you'll probably pay more for service.... especially the Mercedes.....

[Mfm]

I agree w/the previous responses, I have a Sprinter Agile-the short one. It is expensive to service and the closest MB dealer/service center to us will not service it....so a much further drive for service. Also, on the road...if you have a problem, there aren't that many MB dealers/service centers around compared to Ford.

[Roadtrek Adventuous RS1]

Originally Posted by Mfm

I agree w/the previous responses, I have a Sprinter Agile-the short one. It is expensive to service and the closest MB dealer/service center to us will not service it....so a much further drive for service. Also, on the road...if you have a problem, there aren't that many MB dealers/service centers around compared to Ford.

People seem to love the way they drive and perform...the 3 litre V6 Mercedes Benz turbo diesel engine is GREAT when everything is fine...

It's quite a champ.. BUT, this last post is so correct...we were on the road in between Flagstaff and LA... thankfully, we were able to drive straight back home to Los Angeles.. through the Mojave desert... but, when the check engine light came on ... called and discovered that it was either go back to Flagstaff or east to Las Vegas... there's nothing in between... should be a dealership in Barstow, CA... but there is nothing there.....

We were just at the Flagstaff Mercedes Benz dealership for a check engine light and another thing tripped off in the emissions system...got back and discovered that the entire emissions system was failing.. Mercedes Benz replaced the entire system under warranty..whew! Glad for that..it would have been over $4,000...

Warranty on the emissions is 8 years or 80,000 miles.. remember that.
We have 41,000 miles on our 2012... which is actually a 2011 Mercedes..go figure.. every manufacturer does this and uses last year's model vehicle for the conversion....

Can't complain too much... Mercedes has been very accommodating to me..we have new airbags up front, driver's side and passengers side..

The dealership network for Mercedes Benz is not as good as Ford...

I'm not saying that I plan on getting rid of my Sprinter.. but, you do have to take precautions to make sure that you're road ready as much as possible before you head out to get hinterlands.... good preventive maintenance is prudent for any vehicle.....

[BBQ]

.

One simple advice

Get yourself an OBD reader that can cancel the codes.

If you ever get stuck with the "Limp mode",
you can whip out the OBD reader, cancel the code
and drive directly to the dealer.

Without the cancelation, you have to "limp" to the dealer.

[Storysrvwego]

6jun18
Flounce,
As others have said the Sprinter will tag your wallet for more money to repair, let alone service. A number of these people claim that not all of the MERCEDES dealers will work on the Sprinter. I find that hard to believe. Of course they will not work on anything coach related but I should think any MERCEDES dealer can, and would provide chassis & powertrain repair and service work.

I have not heard that the FORD Transit requires any more repair than any other FORD product. To me that is a bit more than some other brands but in todays world, the problems across the board with all brands seem to be less than they used to be.

If the Transit chassis provided what my wife and I needed for an RV, it could have been a WINNEBAGO Era we purchased. Why did we reject the Transit? Awkward to move between the front seats of the Transit into the coach area. If we were shorter in stature,the Transit would be more agreeable allthough still nowhere near as nice as making the transition in a Sprinter or the RAM ProMaster. And being totally fair about the cabin finish, my wife and I rate the Sprinter #1, Transit a close second and the RAM is simply last place. From an ergonomics and usability perspective, we much MUCH prefer the ProMaster overall. Actually all three had their pros and cons but the RAM won our vote. The doors for example - Sprinters open and close the nicest. But the RAM doors have the most useful door panels for storage. Things you want at hand as a passenger or driver; much nicer. Kind of typical DODGE/CHRYSLER/RAM ho-hum "plasticky" looking but oh-so spot on for usefulness. Tougher too, in the sense that I don't worry as much about scratches or tears.

But the biggy is simply trying to turn your body parts to go into the coach or back from the seats in the Transit. Your feet get befuddled by the lower dash console. Then your feet catch on the seat frames while your head hits the overhead even though you have already done this dance and think you will be more graceful in future transitions. We never did master a graceful exit or entrance. Perfect execution was mastered by opening the doors and then enter the coach through the slider.

You can make the pilot/Navigator trip to/from the coach easy as cake, a piece of pie in a Sprinter with minimal bumping. It's just a tad bit nicer/about the same in the ProMaster. If some folks have bodies that are simply larger than some, then none of these three vans will be fun to take this path.

Regardless of the frankly awful exercise to get from front to coach in the Transit, we were both attracted to the Transit for other reasons. But then the wobbly nature of the chassis with its higher coach-box was just like the Sprinter. Even when parked, enter the coach from the slider door. Walk around the coach. This is nit picky-ness in action. But even Class C's with duelies wobble rather noticably. Simply a result of higher center of gravity I think. A RAM ProMaster is essentially a unibody design whereas Sprinter and Transit are body on frame. You really have to spend some time behind the wheel of all three but the ProMaster does indeed drive nicer. And virtually no wobble parked or driving down the road. And it's driveability in very gusty winds is rather remarkable.

We do all of our trips on the road. If we were going to go camping where we were driving on lumpy dirt roads, a ProMaster would have been out of the game for us. Transit and especially the Sprinter are tougher for bouncing your RV and all of your pots, pans, glassware, etc. And you can get 4WD in the Sprinter which so far, is the only one of the three that you can get this. So far. Yes the Transit has some prototype buzzing around. Might not come to market? Who knows, yet.

Do you want to tow something? Forget the RAM ProMaster in RV clothing. You'll want to have that tougher chassis and maybe diesel powerplant so you might be able to haul up to 5,000 lbs. Travato will do ok if your towing less than 2,000 lbs. My wife and I want to have fun on our trips. Not hook up, unhook, load/unload some other vehicle behind our Class B so we simply do not care about towing anything. Period. If you want to haul something of weight, get the Transit or the Sprinter.

We are road travelers and stay mostly in RV parks or campgrounds that have ahh, well, more-prissy road surfaces for vehicles. We absolutely LOVE the ProMaster, 3500EXT, front wheel drive, gas powered van as the basis for our WINNEBAGO Travato 59K. The nature of the design with a unibody chassis and particularly no drive line from front to rear means the whole van sits lower. With all of the roof top AC, solar, roof rack, TV antenna and two ham radio antennas that are both low profile, the Travato easily fits into our shop through the 10 foot opening. There was no way a Class B setup with a Transit or Sprinter was going to squeeze into our particular shop.

RAM had diesel and gas versions of the ProMaster at first. Virtually nobody including my wife and I liked driving them. Funky transmission. Once you got used to it's manual-ish nature, it was ok. But the V6 gas engine w/6 spd automatic transmission is way, way nicer. With both of us, full water and sometimes waste tanks and our gear, buzzes up 6% grades nicely. No it's not a PORSCHE. But it masters the 5 and 6 percent grades we have taken it on quite well. Over the ham radio between our Travato and two other cars that we were in a caravan with to a ham swap meet, both car drivers were impressed. This isn't your Vanagon or heavier laden Rialta. A little bit of gear hunting is squashed by either punching the Tow/Haul button or flipping the automatic lever in paddle-shift mode or whatever they call it. Works great and fun too. Mileage? You might have heard it can get 18 mpg. Yes it can. Typically going to be right about 14.8/15 mpg. Depends on how much hill climbing you do and/or in town stop/start which really drags it down. Hey, your asking the engine to drag 8,000+ pounds from dead stops to X mph. And yet it still does it with decent gusto and reasonble mileage. And way cheaper than a lot of diesels that cost you more per gallon.

Ok so you can't stop thinking about the fact that the gas engine can wear out faster than the diesel. True! Do I care? Nope. Diesel drone. Diesel repair costs, if you have the unfortunate luck to have to repair it. Diesel fuel cost. Where is the diesel pump equipped stations (pretty good today). Purchase PRICE of the diesel RV. Ouch. Now if we were going to go full time or had the goal to cross the USA a zillion times or go from Alaska to Cape Horn, I'd have bought a diesel for sure. My wife and I take occasional trips which even over 5 years, we suspect our total mileage acruement will be well within the life of our V6 and transaxle. We suspect if we continue to travel over 10 years and haven't got bored with the Travato or its size, it will still be good. At 5 or 10 years of use, I'm not worried about resale value. I worry more about it right now while it is new, regardless of what the Insurance company says its covered for. Meanwhile, we are enthralled with our purchase decision from stem to stern, including taking nice un-cramped showers. And stupendously comfortable twin beds because WB included decently thick mattress sitting on top of a bed of plastic springs that work amazingly well. Furnace? Water heating? TRUMA COMBI. Simple design really. Not instant hot water but if you can wait just a little, then you have plenty of hot water for a decent wet-bath shower and still can do dishes. Your only limited by the capacity of the waste tanks really.

I hope the above is helpful. My wife and I do like all three brands. We chose the RAM because it matched our needs better. Except for a solar panel connector not plugged in when we picked up our new Travato, we have had ZERO issues with the ProMaster or the WINNEBAGO build out of the Travato coach. Everything works and works well. This FIAT Ducato based RV with it's excellent track record since the 1980's I think, may not be the solution for you. Perhaps a "DODGE"-FORD-MERCEDES thing for your own reasons.

We have choices with pros and cons in all. I hope what you ultimately pick provides reliability with safety along with of course, the FUN FACTOR we are all after.

Gene

[VanFan]

Originally Posted by Storysrvwego

You really have to spend some time behind the wheel of all three but the ProMaster does indeed drive nicer.

I agree. Having driven a Sprinter, Transit, and Promaster in quick succession one day, the Promaster was the obvious leader in terms of handling. Probably that's because it has the tightest turning radius. Also, I was comparing the Mercedes and Ford diesels to a gas engine on the Promaster, and the diesels felt sluggish by comparison. That's especially true of the Ford diesel, which felt very under powered to me. Never driven a Transit with a gas engine, so that might be a better option. But I love driving the Promaster.

[Earthsinger]

I can't speak as to the Transit but I ditched the Sprinter!! Never mind the cost of repairs and maintenance which is substantially more costly. Just finding a place that can do it is a challenge! Not all Mercedes dealers service the Sprinter. They are few and far between. That alone caused me to sell our Sprinter based RV. BTW, I am a female driver. I loved how it drove and handled but the rest of the nonsense made me switch to a good old North American brand. Sprinters don't like bio-diesel either. Another subject altogether.

[avanti]

Originally Posted by Storysrvwego

A number of these people claim that not all of the MERCEDES dealers will work on the Sprinter. I find that hard to believe. Of course they will not work on anything coach related but I should think any MERCEDES dealer can, and would provide chassis & powertrain repair and service work.

You might well think so, but sadly you would be wrong. Sprinter mechanics need to be specially trained, and it is a major commitment stocking Sprinter-specirfic parts. More basically, however, many (most?) Mercedes dealers do not have bays high enough to accept Sprinters. The same is true of Ford dealers, or so I am told.

[Phoebe3]

Originally Posted by avanti

...however, many (most?) Mercedes dealers do not have bays high enough to accept Sprinters. The same is true of Ford dealers, or so I am told.

That is correct in our neck of the woods. There are several Ford dealers around, but only one works on high-roof Transits. They deal with all of the fleet stuff, delivery vans, passenger vans, etc.

Most of the others can work on our 4WD truck so it appears to be a height issue.

[Davydd]

Just look at there inventory when driving by. If a Mercedes Benz dealer has Sprinters in the parking lot or a Ford dealer has Transits in the parking lot odds are they are a servicing dealer. For several years the nearest MB dealer (12 miles away) did not service Sprinters but two years ago they started when they built a new garage. Still I suspect there are way more Ford dealers than MB dealers servicing high top vans. It is just not a make or break decision for me as well as a decision for gas vs. diesel. I couldn't get what I wanted other than a Sprinter from a functional design standpoint.

[Hatteras Jim]

You probably have your answer by now. This is my short story.



I have a 2013 Sprinter high roof and ext. body. Bought new as a cargo van and converted it to a RV.


Good points: Sits high and has great visibility, handles nicely, able to downshift tranny for hills, roomy, fantastic fuel mileage - 19-21.



Bad points: Bluetec emissions system. When this system fails, you get x number of starts before it has to be towed; unless you visit a sprinter repair center. The 4 times that I got this warning, it was always 10 starts left and 500-800 miles away from the closest Sprinter repair center. A simple OBD reader will not reset the count down counter.



Took 5 trips 5,000 miles or greater and it (emissions) failed on 4 of them and always at the worst possible location as far as service is concerned (UP of Michigan for example). In addition to finding a service center, it can be as much as 2 weeks before you can get an appointment. No, they don't really care if you are on vacation or inconvenienced in any way.


All repairs were covered under warranty. I now have 50,000 miles on it and have visited 14 different sprinter service centers in 9 different states.


Just returned from a 12k cross country and the first trip without an issue. However, a breakdown was always on my mind. Very hard to relax.



On one trip, we actually booked service appointments across 8 states ahead of time in case we had a failure. Easier to cancel than obtain. We did this when we had an issue 150 miles into a 12k trip. We even used 3/8 appointments until they fixed the problem (NOx sensors (again)) and then we cancelled the rest.


Maintenance is higher and I was prepared for that. Oil changes run $150+ at the dealer (13 qts @ roughly $10 a qt for starters). Had a 40k service which included oil change, tranny fluid change, fuel filter and brake fluid replacement for $750. Not complaining, just giving you an idea on specific costs.



Would love to do the al-can; however, I would not trust this vehicle in that remote of an area. There are many sprinters out there and many of them are trouble free. Mine unfortunately, is not one of them.


To do it again, my vehicle would be a domestic brand and gasoline powered. Maybe a diesel, if the track record for that brand is a good one.


If you are not planning on taking extensive trips and you have a local sprinter dealer, it may work well for you.



Good luck with your decision.

[quoyle]

Originally Posted by Flounce

Hi,

Context:

My wife is a soccer mom and spends large amounts of time - hours - on weekdays transporting the kids to various classes and events, and waiting in the car for them. We currently have a minivan, a Honda Odyssey. We plan on getting a mid roof car like Ford Transit or Sprinter and add a sink and toilet to the back, maybe some nicer bucket seats in the back.

Question:

My wife wants the Sprinter because it is fancier than the Ford Sprinter. I don't mind paying an extra 10-15K up front but I am more concerned about 1) maintenance costs and 2) cost of repairs and reliability.

Is there some consensus on whether the Sprinter is a lot more expensive to own than the Ford Transit? Will routine maintenance cost more per year, and how much more? Is the Transit more reliable than the Sprinter? Does it cost a lot more to repair the MB Sprinter?

Thank you.

I would strongly recommend the Ford Transit. I've owned two Mercedes Sprinters and could probably get college credit for the time I've spent in Sprinter service waiting lounges. The BIG service problem with Sprinters are their arcanely complicated exhaust systems that break frequently. Even with the smallest exhaust problem, usually with one of dozens of sensors, your van will go into "limp home" mode meaning you cannot drive faster than 40 mph, usually much slower until you get to an authorized Sprinter service center, which are rarely easy to find. On one camping trip in SC it took us two days to drive 300 miles home in limp home mode. Were stopped by the police twice for going to slowly. Mercedes is coming out with a gas Sprinter in 2019. That one might work.

[Yodar]

While the Ford Transit 3.5 eco-boost offers far better performance than the Promaster and Sprinter, I find it disconcerting that I can still find no verification that Ford has engineered a permanent fix for the guibo flexible coupling driveshaft issue that may require replacement every 30K miles. It cost Ford 142 million last year. It's made me lose confidence in Ford's engineering acumen, especially after Ford's recent announcement it's becoming a truck-focused company.

I'm disappointed that the new generation Sprinter appears to have the previous turbodiesel though they offer a new generation inline 6-cyl in Europe on E and S-Class. Benz just recalled 774000 diesels last week due to illegal software, though the V6 was not included. Potential problems with pollution add-ons and concerns over finding prompt service nearby from their dealer network caused me to cross the Sprinter off the list.

The Promaster is based on the Fiat Ducato which (like the current generation Sprinter) was originally introduced in 2006 and far from cutting-edge. Apparently FCA has all but given up on the PM as last month 5 year product roadmap showd that there is no redesign scheduled through 2022 despite sales dropping 36%. Subsequent to pulling the trigger on a PM conversion, I've found that not all Dodge/Ram dealers are fully equipped for PM complete service.

Life is compromise! <sigh>