Alignment issues

[Mtc46jw]

Hi
We have a pleasureway lexor ts and while all the features on it are excellent we have had some issues with it. Namely the loud crashing going over sharp little road edges. Some we have fixed some like the microwave shelf not being screwed in and cabinet doors not adjusted etc..

The other issues like seat comfort can't do much about. However, we had noticed that at any speed over 60 mph the van gets increasingly sensitive to drive. So took it in for an alignment!

The rear axle thrust angle is out and can't be adjusted! Since it has been this way from new, any suggestions. Dodge will say it's the coach builder, coach builder will say it's dodge problem...you get the picture.

We had planned several long trips which would involve interstate travel but van doesn't like to travel at those speeds. Does any b class van?

Lastly Anyone know of a way to fix? Alignment shop said no adjustment at all and go see dodge or coach builder.

Cheers

[BBQ]

Originally Posted by Mtc46jw

Hi...

The rear axle thrust angle is out and can't be adjusted! Since it has been this way from new, any suggestions. Dodge will say it's the coach builder, coach builder will say it's dodge problem...you get the picture.
...

Cheers

Don't take BS like that. A lot of the dealers are lazy and will talk their way out of doing anything.

Go to an independent truck wheel and alignment shop.
They will make it right for you.

[BBQ]

.

Some people installed SumoSpring in their RV.
It is a rubber-like spongy spacer to dampen the suspension.

It might help.

[Mtc46jw]

That's what I did! This is the second alignment. First done at dodge dealer, they just walked away! Will approach them again with latest evidence.

Should these vans comfortably cruise at 70 without lotsa steering input? Maybe I'm asking too much?

Cheers

[Mtc46jw]

Yup had sumos on since day one..helped with swaying a lot. Asked independent shop if it could have caused the problem. He said nope.

[Gobird]

Originally Posted by Mtc46jw

Should these van comfortably cruise at 70 without lotsa steering input? Maybe I'm asking too much?

Cheers

At 70, way too much input for a sports car, but for a 1 ton truck, not so bad.

[JohnnyFry]

Go to a shop that specializes in truck springs and alignment. I had a rear spring problem with my RT 210 ( which is close to GVW in any event) and they were ably to assist when dealers or RV places had no clue.

[booster]

How far is the thrust angle off? Is it out of the "official" manufacturer spec.?

Normally, thrust angle would be more related to dog tracking and steering wheel centering, possible pull to on side sometimes. With the rear axle not being a fixed drive axle, it is possible that the rear wheels are toed out a lot and different side to side, that might mess up the stability.

Thrust angle can be fixed on a unibody, they do it on wrecked cars all the time, but it isn't a pretty procedure and shouldn't be done on a new vehicle. If by some chance the rear axle is bad, that could be easily replaced.

Wandering and wind pushing around would more likely be understeer symptoms or front alignment settings (sometimes even if they are within specs).

For stability you would normally want to have as much positive caster as you can get and maybe 1/8 to 1/4 degree of positive camber and toe in per toe spec middle of range, and not toed out (you have front drive so they might call toe out, but you don't see that much any more)

Understeer, if that is the issue is normally addressed by the rear sway bar size if you have one, or adding one if you don't. The Sumo springs should have helped the wander somewhat as they would stiffen the rear spring rate a bit.

Higher front tire pressure may also help a lot as that can reduce undetsteer.

[Mtc46jw]

Originally Posted by booster

How far is the thrust angle off? Is it out of the "official" manufacturer spec.?

Normally, thrust angle would be more related to dog tracking and steering wheel centering, possible pull to on side sometimes. With the rear axle not being a fixed drive axle, it is possible that the rear wheels are toed out a lot and different side to side, that might mess up the stability.

Thrust angle can be fixed on a unibody, they do it on wrecked cars all the time, but it isn't a pretty procedure and shouldn't be done on a new vehicle. If by some chance the rear axle is bad, that could be easily replaced.

Wandering and wind pushing around would more likely be understeer symptoms or front alignment settings (sometimes even if they are within specs).

For stability you would normally want to have as much positive caster as you can get and maybe 1/8 to 1/4 degree of positive camber and toe in per toe spec middle of range, and not toed out (you have front drive so they might call toe out, but you don't see that much any more)

Understeer, if that is the issue is normally addressed by the rear sway bar size if you have one, or adding one if you don't. The Sumo springs should have helped the wander somewhat as they would stiffen the rear spring rate a bit.

Higher front tire pressure may also help a lot as that can reduce undetsteer.

Yes, the alignment was to factory specs. Even so went to dodge dealer today with the detailed alignment print out and was essentially told to get lost, it was not their problem. He (the service manager) said nothing we can do for you, call dodge if you want.

I will never buy from this American junk mfg again. What a piss-off! He (the service manager) even said it was either hit or the coach builder had modified the frame or I had damaged the truck! Can you believe it?

Spent the day trying to find someone locally to fix it. No luck up here. Debating options. But I can tell you one thing. I hope dodge ( Chrysler) goes belly up. They deserve it. No accountability anymore, just total BS....sorry I'm that pissed!

Hell I even had to remove the five running lights on the roof and seal them because they where full of water! He couldnt do. Just like replacing missing antenna!

It has not been a good experience getting into b class ownership. We obviously lucked out and bought the wrong van for us.

At least the ole westie just keep chugging along and didn't cost what this thing did! Of course that was 25 years ago!

Cheers

[Mtc46jw]

Hi All

Just to let you know that we sold our 2017 Lexor TS at a quite a loss back to the RV dealer. We did this when and AFTER BATTLING Dodge Canada who eventually decided after a month or more they would not honour the warranty help us with the bent rear axle! God knows what the warranty covers and is worth down the road. We decided, not very much.

We even had the issue brought up to the coach builders divisional dodge area rep hoping with their help we might get some action. Nothing happened. Dodge claimed it had no warranty with the coach builder!

After many calls to “Dodge central” and visiting our local dealerships we were finally advised by dodge that since our pleasureway van had been modified the warranty claim was closed and therefore useless to us!

No one wanted to help us get this fixed, no one. Can you imagine the future with this van? We did and decided it was not worth it for us to continue with it, the van must have been a lemon. There were many other smaller issues that the local dodge dealer would not even look at! That we decided would wait for more important axle and frame fix.

Also tried here in Ontario to just replace the beam axle ( at my expense) in the rear and straighten things out but those shops called never even returned our calls.

I STRONGLY suggest that anyone considering this chassis as a B class van might want to seriously rethink your potential relationship with Dodge. It was as we found out not worth the paper it’s written on.

Had we heard of this warranty refusal problem (not uncommon on pro master forums) with dodge before we bought the van we most certainly wouldn’t have bought it in the first place. We would have like stayed with the original sprinter idea. Yah, I know hind sight is perfect right.

I assume at some point other owners will have problems with these vans like we did and will look for warranty assistance. Good luck to them, we wish them well, Hell, my dealer wouldn’t even seal the five roof lights that were full of water! Or look at anything else on the van. I hope you all fared better than we did.

Anyway, another dream down the drain for now.

[peteco]

What did Pleasureway have to say in all of this? My impression is that they are a good company with good customer service. If they did not help at all then they should be steered clear of by any potential buyer. Of course buyers should stay away from this dealer too.

[Mtc46jw]

Originally Posted by peteco

What did Pleasureway have to say in all of this? My impression is that they are a good company with good customer service. If they did not help at all then they should be steered clear of by any potential buyer. Of course buyers should stay away from this dealer too.

I spoke to pleasureway several times and it seemed they could not do much. They said they had a warranty agreement with Dodge, but we saw no such evidence. They said they would intercede with their local Saskatoon dodge rep talking to “dodge central” but whether they did or not is moot as there never any confirmation from them that they did, and the results speak for themselves.

Our problems with dodge maybe unique, and others never have to use the warranty and I hope that’s the case. I just want to caution everyone, when it comes down to a serious issue, you are on your own and there is nothing you can do about it! No one will own up, only point fingers at each other! YMMV

CHEERS

[peteco]

Originally Posted by Mtc46jw

I spoke to pleasureway several times and it seemed they could not do much. They said they had a warranty agreement with Dodge, but we saw no such evidence. They said they would intercede with their local Saskatoon dodge rep talking to “dodge central” but whether they did or not is moot as there never any confirmation from them that they did, and the results speak for themselves.

Our problems with dodge maybe unique, and others never have to use the warranty and I hope that’s the case. I just want to caution everyone, when it comes down to a serious issue, you are on your own and there is nothing you can do about it! No one will own up, only point fingers at each other! YMMV

CHEERS

Sounds like ultimately Pleasureway failed you, as they failed to hold Dodge accountable. Somehow Pleasureway should have made it right.

[Mtc46jw]

Yes, I expected more from them. Was disappointed to be sure. I guess they are all the same, I have only the one experience to measure against so am likely quite tainted. Maybe I’m just too old to put up with crap anymore. Or maybe I realize most just bullshit in the hope of baffling brains. I come from a time when action defines response, not useless words. So, Yah we got a lemon for sure.

Sure hope no one bought it after us. Strange, I have looked for for it months and never even saw it at the RV dealer site or on auto trader. Sorry for the rant, just I’m still feeling burned by the whole experience.

[peteco]

Originally Posted by Mtc46jw

Yes, I expected more from them. Was disappointed to be sure. I guess they are all the same, I have only the one experience to measure against so am likely quite tainted. Maybe I’m just too old to put up with crap anymore. Or maybe I realize most just bullshit in the hope of baffling brains. I come from a time when action defines response, not useless words. So, Yah we got a lemon for sure.

Sure hope no one bought it after us. Strange, I have looked for for it months and never even saw it at the RV dealer site or on auto trader. Sorry for the rant, just I’m still feeling burned by the whole experience.

Thanks for sharing and sorry you went through all this pain. The more I hear about non-accountability at all levels these days makes me realize I should just stick with my old low-tech Roadtrek that has everything working right now, and fix it when it breaks.

[Mtc46jw]

That would be a SMART move. If I could find an old westfalia European van in decent shape for a decent price I would be all over it. Sometimes “Old(er)” is better! Lol..lol..

[MsNomer]

Very interesting thread. I've been on the PM forum for more than three years and, to the best of my recollection, this is the first time I've seen an axle issue. PM generally drives like a dream at high speeds. I'm suspecting Pleasureway.

Clearance lights were a TSB item my dealer addressed even though mine didn't leak.

[Mtc46jw]

Yes that is what we thought too! However the “other”problems that we inherited, such as the crashing sounds of a microwave self that wasn’t screwed down, the entire engine bay and all the fittings on the underside covered in white salt/ brine residue were only the tip of the iceberg. The front end was a mess with the driving lights not connected on one side. The front end rattled like hell going over small bumps. The the drivers door trim won’t stay on and had to be glued to stay down. Then the awning periodically that would periodically not retract. It twice refused to start for several minutes on its own, etc, etc,

The crashing over sharp bumps was never resolved and axle was just the final straw. Something mysterious happened to this so called new van. We are happy to be rid of it! Not the $ loss, but the headaches we had with it.

Going over 60 was a real chore and required strict attention, or you where ditch bound! Hence the beginning of the alignment woes and the subsequent axle discovery. I don’t think the fixing the axle would have made life any or much better especially with all the other issues. I still will never buy any dodge product, after our experience,they are just the worst.

[Joan Good]

My heart goes out to you. I just purchased a Zion from Roadtrek on a Pro-Master chassis.
Keeping everything crossed for no problems. Called local dealership who said they would give me a walk through even though it is not their obligation. I took a big risk at 74 to make such a large purchase and am non-mechanical to boot. Yikes! The best to you. I was looking into the Pleasure Way, but they never sent the brochures. There was never any follow up of any kind, so I gave up not wanting to buy a lack of customer service. On
the other hand RoadTrek has been GREAT to deal with! Best of everything. Buying a RV takes a lot of risk.

[Mtc46jw]

Originally Posted by Joan Good

My heart goes out to you. I just purchased a Zion from Roadtrek on a Pro-Master chassis.
Keeping everything crossed for no problems. Called local dealership who said they would give me a walk through even though it is not their obligation. I took a big risk at 74 to make such a large purchase and am non-mechanical to boot. Yikes! The best to you. I was looking into the Pleasure Way, but they never sent the brochures. There was never any follow up of any kind, so I gave up not wanting to buy a lack of customer service. On
the other hand RoadTrek has been GREAT to deal with! Best of everything. Buying a RV takes a lot of risk.

Kudos to you!

Hope all goes well with you and your travels with the roadtrek. Hope you never have to deal with Dodge or roadtrek for any significant issues! In our case, neither one helped us, which meant we are still without a van! The loss was too great and I will not have another pro master based van. That’s just us, burnt once is enough!

We loved the experience of B class van travelling. It was the execution that let us down. I think both parties, Dodge and Pleasureway knew something was amiss with our lemon and decided to let us just eat it.

Curiously, I have seen an ad for our van in any autotrader or rev trader since we dumped it?

Good luck and safe travels. You will enjoy it!

Cheers