Aktiv or Travato59G | Decision Time

[avanti]

Originally Posted by GeorgeRa

I clearly consider large hose or small hose a pain making my current camping more enjoyable so I don’t have to think of imminent use of a dump station with possible left over goodies and about 5-10 min of splashing feces pain. Judging that the cassette system as a pain, without a direct experience, could easily be considered biased.

I have an open mind, but it is hard for me to imagine anything being better than my current setup with a small, sealed macerator-driven hose, and a gravity-hose backup. Maybe I would feel differently if I ever actually had to use the backup, but in 12 years of B-vanning and two similarly-equipped rigs, I have never had the pleasure.

The one thing I miss about my previous rig's setup was the fact that it had a single black/gray tank, which I greatly prefer. But, we have discussed that topic amply in the past.

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by avanti

I have an open mind, but it is hard for me to imagine anything being better than my current setup with a small, sealed macerator-driven hose, and a gravity-hose backup. Maybe I would feel differently if I ever actually had to use the backup, but in 12 years of B-vanning and two similarly-equipped rigs, I have never had the pleasure.

The one thing I miss about my previous rig's setup was the fact that it had a single black/gray tank, which I greatly prefer. But, we have discussed that topic amply in the past.

In my last trailer, I had the macerator setup with detachable 1” dia. hose. So, indeed the sealed permanently attached hose like the Thetford Sani Con is the best black tank scenario and I am not surprise you like it. If you had a macerator failure and had to deal with gravity dump and fixing the pump your view could change. On my boat, I kept spare pump just in case. Failure of the macerator pump on a boat is a disaster, there is no plan B via a larger hose.

George.

[mumkin]

The advantage of the cassette for someone like me is that with only one person... and nearly all short trips... and no place near my home to dump, the cassette would be empty enough for me to handle and dump in my bathroom at home.

When I was spending weeks traveling, I would definitely prefer a decent sized black tank with a macerator like I had in my Libero.

[GeorgeRa]

Déjà vu on this forum - http://www.classbforum.com/forums/f5...-not-2625.html

It is interesting how on one Earth we have so different approaches and all are the best.

Cheers,

George.

[gregmchugh]

It seems the poop related discussions of composting and cassette toilets generate some of the most contentious responses. Toilet training issues maybe...

[cjscott123]

Originally Posted by 4DMTNS

The time has finally come to invest in my dream ClassB, and I have negotiated deals for both rigs that the dealers will honor through early December.

Over the last six months I have done intense research, including crawling all through, over and under BOTH rigs. I've read through threads on this forum, read blogs and watched video reviews. And, I've never passed up an opportunity to learn from a ClassB owner while I'm out-n-about! I'm not on Facebook, which I understand has a few good groups to ask questions.

Even as a newbie to this type of purchase, I feel like I've done my due diligence BUT it never hurts to ask experienced owners what have I missed? What would you look at?

My work schedule allows me to be out camping, hiking, snowshoeing and generally adventuring. I work two days on, then have 2-3 off days. At least once a week I have a 3-day off stretch. I plan to use this rig year-round. It will be about ten years before I retire, and I hope this rig turns into a full-time travel rig for at least 5yrs at that point.

I'm a solo traveler along back-country paved and gravel roads in the Northwest, lately beyond cell service more than half the time. I travel with an older, active hunting dog. Every once in a while my significant other will join us for a few days.

Here are the reasons the Aktiv is appealing: storage, higher/larger bed, flexible table setup, solar w/lithium batteries, internal fresh water lines, compressor refrigerator, cassette toilet, grey water tank easily wrapped, and it has a spare tire.

While Hymer is well known, it is a new player in North America and has only ONE local service dealer option. I know I can get service from any RoadTrek dealer as well, but those dealers are 60-100 miles outside of Portland metro. The six year/unlimited warranty on the ClassB components is only as good as the dealer that services it. I have no concern about Dodge options for oil changes and chassis service.

Until I saw the Hymer yesterday, I was actually going to move forward with the Travato59G, wait for the 2017-5 Travato59G with internal waterlines, or order a ProMaster and have it locally up-fitted to my specs.

The current Travato59G remains appealing because: it would be about $13k less and is available in the next week, the layout is good, and the dealership service network is larger. The cost savings would be reduced by the aftermarket line and tank wrapping I would need to have done, and the expense of buying and mounting a spare tire on the roof.

Am I thinking of everything? Thank you in advance for your input. Chris

Hard choice, given the price I may choose the Travato BUT I think wanting to do it year round, only being yourself, you may like the plumbing and cassette, as having to find a dump can be a pain, tho dumping the cassette may be equally a pain. We also hated the bench dinette seating in the Travato, so awkward and uncomfortable, which was why we didn't choose it and ended up with the Winnebago Era 70X. We are active and am hoping Roadtrek brings some of Hymer's European models with the large pass through garages here, if they do we may trade our Era for one. I see they have a new one that Camping World will be selling which is the Hymer Sunlight V1 which is similar to the 59K Travato setup. It's a nice floorplan but it doesn't work for the two of us as we sometimes bring a third guest and need seating or sleeping for a child. Again we almost purchased the Travato 59G over the Era but absolutely HATED the dinette area. HATED. The table was awkward and constantly banged your legs into it, and the seat was the most uncomfortable thing we ever sat in. You literally could not bringing a third guest and actually ask them to sit in that seat for any length of travel time. With the Aktiv which we saw in Hershey show, we were pleasantly surprised that the table and seat were done much better IMO. It is also shorter and very very nice to look at on the outside. The dinette seat is more comfortable to sit on, the table was not in your way the way it is in the Travato.

[Keyne]

If you like the 59G interior layout that is similar to the Aktiv; IMO I would go with the Travato. The Travato has been out for a while (2014?) and refined and the Aktiv is new with a lot of teething problems (again my opinion). For me if I didn't want to wait I would go with the proven Travato.

[BBQ]

Originally Posted by Keyne

If you like the 59G interior layout that is similar to the Aktiv; IMO I would go with the Travato. The Travato has been out for a while (2014?) and refined and the Aktiv is new with a lot of teething problems (again my opinion). For me if I didn't want to wait I would go with the proven Travato.

The Aktiv has been for sale in Europe for a few years.
It is not a new design.

[gregmchugh]

Originally Posted by BBQ

The Aktiv has been for sale in Europe for a few years.
It is not a new design.

The Aktiv is based on the Hymer Grand Canyon which is sold in Europe but it is not identical. The issues seen on the Aktiv are related to both the capability to build the common features to the same level of quality as seen in Europe and to the electrical system changes made over here: EcoTrek batteries, Voltstart autostart, Underhood Generator and inverter. I don't recall any reported issues with the solar panels or solar controller.

[rockymtnb]

Originally Posted by ClassB4Me

How is the grey tank water any worse than the dirty water coming off the car you wash in your driveway (road salt, bird poop, etc.)?

Originally Posted by avanti

Not even close. You can prove this by smelling some of each after waiting a few days.

Our Sportsmobile Sprinter has a 'pure' grey water tank in the sense that it only collects sink and shower water, whereas the cassette toilet blackwater is completely sealed and separate. Therefore I often drain the grey water onto our lawn after trips and hadn't noticed any odors.

But I didn't have a full tank to really test the question above until our latest trip. Perhaps risking an olfactory assault I drained some of the greywater into a bucket, then swirled it around like a giant Brandy snifter. Result - No noticeable smell!

I was bit surprised it didn't smell at all, but that may be a factor of our usage and being a purely separate grey water tank. We don't poop or pee in the shower, we tend to cook outside so we're not dumping lots of bacon grease in the sink, and we shower with biodegradable backpackers soap.

But I don't expect that result can be extended to standard grey/blackwater systems. Our old Provan Tiger had the standard black/grey dump with combined outlet, and even when we didn't use the toilet the greywater effluent stunk, perhaps due to mixing between the grey and black tank outlets. In any case the greywater could be fecal contaminated and must be handled appropriately as sewage.

I would never suggest that anyone drain any tank within a campground. But if an Activ owner uses their greywater similar to ours I wouldn't worry about draining it onto their lawn or somewhere similar.

[mumkin]

Of course draining onto your own yard would be your decision.

BUT, I have always had separate black and gray tanks. And the only tank that gave me great problems with smell was the gray tank (not the black) with my first Class B. It would stink up the whole RV. I started using Happy Camper in the gray tank, and that ended the smell issues. Actually I almost never showered in the rigs, so the smell was all from my limited dish washing. And that was even being careful to have as little food material get down as possible.

I have never dumped it anywhere but into the sewer.

[4DMTNS]

Picked up The Rig as we refer to it on Friday, 28April with a whopping 30 miles on the odometer. First stop was Gresham Dodge to get some quick issues with the flashing mileage and odometer on the dash, check the tire pressures and figure out why the doors would not lock that Blue Dog RV had not taken the time to resolve. They kindly drew me a map to get me there. <--- Do NOT even ask me about this, I will not respond.

Gresham Dodge was wonderful, and I left with 31 miles on the odometer happy to return to see them for my first scheduled service. Having visited two other Dodge dealers to check out the service departments, I will be scheduling chassis service out in Gresham.

Drove The Rig back to our house and parked and filled tanks, packed gear and ten days of supplies and got it ready for departure the next morning, once I received the overnight FedEx delivery of the driver and passenger headrests that Blue Dog RV did not realize were missing during the 8-days they had it. Hymer sent the headrests directly to my house for Saturday delivery! Go Hymer!

Over the last three weeks, I have driven it more than 1500 miles, overnighted in it eight nights, driven it to work nine days, taken it grocery shopping, parallel parked, drove it in tight city streets, jumped in/out of HOV lanes, made three modifications, driven it over Mt Hood in a snow storm, driven it on single lane dirt roads to scout wild campsites, had the TomTom disconnected, and tested everything except the microwave (gonna remove it), DVD player, and shower. Oh yeah, forgot to fill the propane tank so had to back up over a cement pad and pavers to get the tank filled at Terrebonne Hardware. And, I've discovered the free dump stations with Clean Water Services.

Like any new rig, there have been issues. Mostly finish items, and one warranty issue requiring immediate attention. Johnson RV is an authorized Hymer/RoadTrek warranty service site; I am scheduled for mid-June to have them locate what seems to be a loose connection between the water pump and the faucet that slowly drips at the low point under The Rig when we use the water pump. I've poked around and have yet to locate any moisture inside, and when I reach up under the chassis cannot immediately find a source. I will be looking underneath again with a flashlight later this week.

Others have mentioned problems with the inverter, I have AGM batteries and have had no issues.

Fully loaded with gear and supplies for ten days, fresh water at capacity, full propane tank and full has tank, it tops out at 8000lbs, average mpg has been 14 since I took delivery.

Here are links to the three modifications:

[1] Mounted the spare tire inside
https://instagram.com/p/BThew3LlLz7/

[2] Modified the bed to not require tilting the spare tire at night.
https://instagram.com/p/BUQWxBWljuf/

[3] Dog barrier on cargo door area.
https://instagram.com/p/BT4o2OHluu1/

Thanks again for others sharing their experiences, feel free to ask me questions. I'll check on the board again in a few days.

[techfan]

Re the cassette toilet in the Aktiv

The Russos of the blog/You Tube series, We're The Russos, have been loaned an Aktiv 2.0 for a year for full time travel. In their most recent video they have already decided to only use the toilet for #1 after only two weeks. See there video here and rationale begins at 6:56.
https://youtu.be/nreqjd7g3pY

[mrshowtime3]

Originally Posted by techfan

Re the cassette toilet in the Aktiv

The Russos of the blog/You Tube series, We're The Russos, have been loaned an Aktiv 2.0 for a year for full time travel. In their most recent video they have already decided to only use the toilet for #1 after only two weeks. See there video here and rationale begins at 6:56.
https://youtu.be/nreqjd7g3pY

Yea I dont get why someone would want to deal with that. Defeats a major purpose of having a RV to us. But to each their own. If you always have to go to the bathroom in a public facility, or a hole in the ground, you probably work out way cheaper to just travel in a mini van or SUV and stay at hotels and cabins at campgrounds.

[avanti]

Originally Posted by mrshowtime3

Yea I dont get why someone would want to deal with that. Defeats a major purpose of having a RV to us. But to each their own. If you always have to go to the bathroom in a public facility, or a hole in the ground, you probably work out way cheaper to just travel in a mini van or SUV and stay at hotels and cabins at campgrounds.

Totally agree. I have never understood the "don't use the plumbing" mentality. What are folks saving it for? I also agree that any system that was so ill-designed as to cause us to avoid using it would be a non-starter for us.

[Saldar]

I agree on "use it" if it's part of the van. We moved up from a tent trailer with no plumbing. Still in our 2 month old Travato it took 2 trips before we came to grips with weeing "in the car", and so far we have drawn the line at #1. I think me and DH are playing chicken on that. It might help that we just completed our "pee-shooter" so we can empty when we get home. It's the garbage disposal to septic tank idea, and it's pumping through 75' ft of garden hose like a champ. The Russo's have more dumping experience than we do, and I think it's reasonable the disposer person gets to decide. Like us, she might change her mind after she gets more experience or has an emergency.

[techfan]

Originally Posted by Saldar

I agree on "use it" if it's part of the van. We moved up from a tent trailer with no plumbing. Still in our 2 month old Travato it took 2 trips before we came to grips with weeing "in the car", and so far we have drawn the line at #1. I think me and DH are playing chicken on that. It might help that we just completed our "pee-shooter" so we can empty when we get home. It's the garbage disposal to septic tank idea, and it's pumping through 75' ft of garden hose like a champ. The Russo's have more dumping experience than we do, and I think it's reasonable the disposer person gets to decide. Like us, she might change her mind after she gets more experience or has an emergency.

To remind... they have already lived full time in an A and are now going to live full time in a B. They are very familiar with using the bath but might be figuring out that a cassette toilet is more of a challenge when full timing. Too much like a porta potty, which we had, and why we like our black tank.

[GeorgeRa]

It is amazing how this Black Hole attraction brings folks to discuss this subject and I am glad that diet versus #2 features is not discussed yet, but it is lurking beyond the event horizon.

I copy from the Dometic site different styles toilet systems, so let’s ask the question which one is the best? https://www.dometic.com/en-us/us/pro...t-buying-guide

My answer is - each one of them is the best for its particular application which vary from folks using RV with its primary function of the comfy discharges of #1s and #2s to ordinary camping folks simply enjoying being out.