Water heater - Ready?

[rowiebowie]

Has anyone tried heating their Suburban 6 gal. with propane and electric simultaneously? User guide says it's an option to speed recovery.

I haven't tried mine on both heat sources simultaneously, but it seems it would provide nearly continuous hot water due to it's fast recovery time.

.

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by rowiebowie

Has anyone tried heating their Suburban 6 gal. with propane and electric simultaneously? User guide says it's an option to speed recovery.

I haven't tried mine on both heat sources simultaneously, but it seems it would provide nearly continuous hot water due to it's fast recovery time.

.

This chart with recovery times should help you.

https://www.airxcel.com/suburban/pro...e-water-heater

[InterBlog]

I should have qualified my response. I was looking for an on-demand water heater that would either add to, or swap out, in place of the Atwood dinosaur, without having to do major upgrades to anything else. Much of our van falls into the "ain't broke don't fix it" category, including the furnace. There's no way I would build a van today the way ours was originally built, but it is what it is. And all of the in-kind standalone on-demand water heaters I found required flow rates that were too high.

Sometimes my husband and I spend the cash to make the kind of upgrades that most people would not, but the ROI has to justify it. Typically the perceived ROI relates to whatever is the rate-limiting system-du-jour. We are not currently hot-water-limited.

[rowiebowie]

Originally Posted by GeorgeRa

This chart with recovery times should help you.

https://www.airxcel.com/suburban/pro...e-water-heater

Thanks. Good to know I can boost my 6gpm water heater recovery time by more than double by running simultaneously on electric & propane.

First, I need to test the new thermostats and limiting switches I recently installed (electric & propane) to make sure they work properly.

[Yoshimura]

Originally Posted by InterBlog

It's been discussed in other threads, and I did a fair amount of research on the on-demand option. What I found is that that the water throughput demands of various models are too high to support a Class B boondocking scenario. Yes, they can be made to work, but they'll cost the user a lot of water in the process - water that boondockers can't afford to spare. So I stuck with the old dinosaur Atwood 6-gallon batch heater. I rarely use all 6 gallons at a time, but I can just leave the residual in there and heat it up again later.

If you've hit upon an on-demand model for which this is NOT the case, I'd love to know which one it is.

I was very disapointed to find a tank after we took delevery of our Simplicity (most Roadtrek documentation specified an On-Demand system) and even tought replacing it with a tank less system.

Could you elaborate on why a tank less system could be problematic on a Class B?

[InterBlog]

Originally Posted by Yoshimura

I was very disapointed to find a tank after we took delevery of our Simplicity (most Roadtrek documentation specified an On-Demand system) and even tought replacing it with a tank less system.

Could you elaborate on why a tank less system could be problematic on a Class B?

Well, as the posters elaborated above, it depends on WHAT KIND of tankless.

Let me talk about the lower-end option.

The kinds of units that are (a) propane-fired and (b) potentially swappable with standard Class B equipment require a through-put in the neighborhood of 2 gallons per minute.

Well, do the math. I have a 26 gallon fresh water tank that I routinely have to stretch to last one to two weeks at a time off-grid. That allots me 2 to 4 gallons of water per day TOTAL, not just hot water, but water for all uses including the toilet, meal preparation, tea, etc.

Those water heaters consume a throughput equal to my entire day's ration of water in 60 to 120 seconds. It's clearly not a viable option.

Now, if someone is a hook-up camper, this is not a barrier because water use is not as limited. But on average, I only hook up 1 or 2 days out of about every 50 days on the road.

This is an example of where Instagram is telling major lies and doing us all a disservice in multiple ways. One of the most popular types of #vanlife post is the depiction of the young clueless female mostly-naked nymph taking a shower in the great outdoors using one of these tankless propane heaters which is strapped to the rear door of the van for venting purposes. As she's there posing in over-sexualized ecstasy at the miracle of an off-grid hot shower, the rest of us are going, "Yeah, right." It's total BS. No van can carry enough water to make that scenario work. But it gets plenty of "likes" on IG.

I posted an IG comment yesterday which read as follows: Real women BUILD vans - they don't pose naked in front of them. Vanlife mythology is a minor irritation to me because it's so disingenuous in these ways.

[Yoshimura]

Originally Posted by InterBlog

Let me talk about the lower-end option.

The kinds of units that are (a) propane-fired and (b) potentially swappable with standard Class B equipment require a through-put in the neighborhood of 2 gallons per minute.

The tank-less unit in the Zion requires a minimum of 0.9 gallon per minute (according to documentation). Is this incorrect?

[GeorgeRa]

Zion has Alde which is hydronic.

Correction, I think it is hydronic for space heating but it could be direct for water, it has 2.2 gal hot water tank.
https://www.alde.us/why-choose-alde/...system-unique/

[Yoshimura]

Originally Posted by GeorgeRa

Zion has Alde which is hydronic.

Correction, I think it is hydronic for space heating but it could be direct for water, it has 2.2 gal hot water tank.
https://www.alde.us/why-choose-alde/...system-unique/

Aide is optionnel. Standard is Girard GSWH-2 and requires 0.9 g/min according to documentation.

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by Yoshimura

Aide is optionnel. Standard is Girard GSWH-2 and requires 0.9 g/min according to documentation.

I didn’t know that, I look at some posts discussing problems with Alde on Roadtrek. With direct heating of water in a boiler, even if flow of 0.9 gal./min you will need to provide water before to get system started. Look at many reviews online of on demand direct water heaters in RVs, you will save LPG but use more water, your pick.

Most of RVs use 4-6 gallons old fashion water heaters and they are still happy campers. Malaga from Propex is a little better but still an old-style water heater. There is a value in having 4-6 gal of hot water on board, it is instantly available at your shower or sink. You can have quick delivery of hot water at a sink with on demand water heater but each time you turn the faucet you will waste a couple of gallons of precious water before getting hot water.

From my perspective, your water heater is the best choice of the 3 options you had – your vanilla water heater, on demand or a very new, complex and unknown in NA Alde.

[InterBlog]

Originally Posted by GeorgeRa

...

From my perspective, your water heater is the best choice of the 3 options you had – your vanilla water heater, on demand or a very new, complex and unknown in NA Alde.

+1. That's what I concluded in my own case, to my surprise. The old tech turned out to be the best tech, for once.

Anyone thinking about Alde products should maybe review the Air Forums thread titled "Much ado about Alde" (830 posts!) or the expose' published by Class B Warned – Well, This Hasn't Gone Well.

[NFRicaS]

Is there such a thing as a hot water heater that works via your shore power..ie; electric only?

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by NFRicaS

Is there such a thing as a hot water heater that works via your shore power..ie; electric only?

How about a marine water heater like Isotemp or West Marine or others. Most of them have AC electric heater built in and can be heated by shore power or engine coolant or hydronic heater like Espar. I have 4 gal. Isotemp and Espar D5 which can be powered by shore power or diesel. The Isotemp heater has 750W electric heater which is less than most of RV LPG water heaters.

Search for “marine water heater”:
https://www.google.com/search?q=mari...=2560&bih=1298

[stevebass]

It may be too late for you, but here's what we use:

Refrigerator Thermometer Wireless Indoor/Outdoor Digital Sensor with Audible Alarm. It comes with two wireless monitors. I have on in the fridge and the other stuck inside the insulation of the water heater.

I set the alarm to go off at 93 degrees (another separate alarm for the fridge). The unit also monitors the temp in the cabin.

It's about $26 on Amazon
http://tinyurl.com/y9jvvzd2