Water Heater

Mars Hotel · 11-09-2021, 11:57 PM

Sorry about asking basic questions but about to purchase our Class B and wonder about the water heater. I do not want to assume the water heater is an on demand for the shower to conserve fresh water. Is this usually the case or do you need to upgrade or replace to the on demand heater. The dealer will tell me anything I want to hear so of course have a lack of trust. Thanks.

SteveJ · 11-10-2021, 04:39 AM

This is how we deal with a Suburban conventional water heater.

We only heat the water to shower temperature and only just before showering. We use only the water from the hot faucet. This way there is no blending of water nor a nasty blast of hot or cold water when restarting the shower as we Navy shower. Our 6 gallons of temperate water is enough for both of us. We use an Oxygenics shower head with a full shut off valve attached to it. we catch the initial 2 quarts of the cold water in the pipes to use for making coffee or tea. We do drink the water from our tanks.

From what I understand the Truma is a good unit and works well, the Girard, not so well, at least for dry camping. The flow rate required for the Girard to kick in is quite high from what I've heard and wastes a fair bit of water.

For other domestic hot water needs we just heat what we need on the cooktop.

Somewhere around 90+% of our camping is dry/boondocking so we are all about conserving water. The above routines help us do that.

Have fun with your new rig.

Rlum · 11-10-2021, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mars Hotel

Sorry about asking basic questions but about to purchase our Class B and wonder about the water heater. I do not want to assume the water heater is an on demand for the shower to conserve fresh water. Is this usually the case or do you need to upgrade or replace to the on demand heater. The dealer will tell me anything I want to hear so of course have a lack of trust. Thanks.

I believe most new class b now offer a tankless hot water heater. I have the Truma but not the recirculation version. You will need to get the recirculation model. Plumbing also has to done so the cold water sitting in the hot water line can be returned to the water heater. This will avoid wasting water until temp is correct, thus saving water.

I previously had a Girard. I would get either freezing cold or scalding hot water. Very difficult to get consistently temperate water. Finally gave it away and changed to Truma. Much better. Truma has a 1 liter bottle which acts like a tank. Keeps water temperature consistent.

avanti · 11-10-2021, 12:59 PM

Most any water setup would benefit from a tempering valve, which can be set to a desired water temperature. They are essential for "aggressive" instant hot-water heaters, such as flash-plate water-water heat exchangers as used with hydronic systems.

SteveJ · 11-10-2021, 05:32 PM

We had to install a new shower faucet in our Safari and really wanted to go with a tempering faucet. I could only find a few and they all used approximately 6" center to center water intakes. I saw quite a few reviews of folks having difficulty with installing them, water leaks and room being common issues. Maybe there is something different out there now as it was a year ago that we were doing this.

GeorgeRa · 11-10-2021, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveJ

We had to install a new shower faucet in our Safari and really wanted to go with a tempering faucet. I could only find a few and they all used approximately 6" center to center water intakes. I saw quite a few reviews of folks having difficulty with installing them, water leaks and room being common issues. Maybe there is something different out there now as it was a year ago that we were doing this.

I have tempering valve right at the water heater, it came with it - Isotemp Marine WH.

avanti · 11-10-2021, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeorgeRa

I have tempering valve right at the water heater, it came with it - Isotemp Marine WH.

Same with our Espar. You can get tempering valves at Home Depot.

SteveJ · 11-11-2021, 12:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeorgeRa

I have tempering valve right at the water heater, it came with it - Isotemp Marine WH.

The problem with the tempering valve at the heater is it does not adjust the temperature at the faucet. When doing the Navy shower it can be off for 2-4 minutes. If it's not hot out the water in the line from the water heater to the faucet will cool, maybe a little, maybe a lot. With the valve at the heater all of the water must be flushed from that line before the temperature is right again, wasting water. If the valve is at the faucet the correction to the water temperature would be immediate at the shower faucet, no waiting for the line to clear.

My assumption on tank mounted tempering valves is that they are installed so the water heater can be set at a higher temp for more capacity as it gets diluted with cold so you can use more hot water without the scalding issue.

As mentioned before, the ideal situation for us would be tempering at the valve. The current system we use does work for us as the six gallon heater provides enough water for two consecutive showers once up to shower temperature. Our goal was(is?) to have an even temperature in the shower, not to use more water. Some sort of solenoid activated return line could be installed but I'm not gonna go there.

GeorgeRa · 11-11-2021, 01:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveJ

The problem with the tempering valve at the heater is it does not adjust the temperature at the faucet. When doing the Navy shower it can be off for 2-4 minutes. If it's not hot out the water in the line from the water heater to the faucet will cool, maybe a little, maybe a lot. With the valve at the heater all of the water must be flushed from that line before the temperature is right again, wasting water. If the valve is at the faucet the correction to the water temperature would be immediate at the shower faucet, no waiting for the line to clear.

My assumption on tank mounted tempering valves is that they are installed so the water heater can be set at a higher temp for more capacity as it gets diluted with cold so you can use more hot water without the scalding issue.

As mentioned before, the ideal situation for us would be tempering at the valve. The current system we use does work for us as the six gallon heater provides enough water for two consecutive showers once up to shower temperature. Our goal was(is?) to have an even temperature in the shower, not to use more water. Some sort of solenoid activated return line could be installed but I'm not gonna go there.

I don’t have shower just the sink which is about 5’ away to the heater. It is connected with ½” tubing. It takes seconds for me to get hot water, you must have long connection to your heater tank.
Water tempering valve prevents high temperature and above 115F to 122F allows cold water in. I am not sure this would help you a lot with a few minutes waiting.

Return line or a small point of use electric heater could be best options.

Mars Hotel · 11-11-2021, 03:12 AM

Thank you for the answer. That information will be very helpful….

Mars Hotel · 11-11-2021, 03:14 AM

Great info. I appreciate the response. Conserving water will be a big issue when not available for long trips without access to resupply.

SteveJ · 11-11-2021, 03:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeorgeRa

I don’t have shower just the sink which is about 5’ away to the heater. It is connected with ½” tubing. It takes seconds for me to get hot water, you must have long connection to your heater tank.
Water tempering valve prevents high temperature and above 115F to 122F allows cold water in. I am not sure this would help you a lot with a few minutes waiting.

Return line or a small point of use electric heater could be best options.

George, we have over a 15' run from the water heater to the shower(over 20' to the kitchen sink) due to a home run plumbing setup in our current setup. It takes about 2+ quarts of water for it to just start feeling not cold. That adds up when trying to conserve water but that water does get repurposed the way we do it. The quantities were different but we had the same procedure in the RT.

As almost all of our camping is sans hookups the electric point of use heater is not practical.

Way simpler and easier to continue as we have been doing. It's worked well for us for almost six years.

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