Thoughts on Roadtrek vs. Pleasure Way vs. Airstream Sprinter models?

[RossWilliams]

It is ILLEGAL to sell anything other than B20 for road vehicles in Minnesota, except in winter. But yes, if you want to burn home fuel oil in your rig you can find it.

[avanti]

Originally Posted by RossWilliams

It is ILLEGAL to sell anything other than B20 for road vehicles in Minnesota, except in winter. But yes, if you want to burn home fuel oil in your rig you can find it.

Yes, that’s what I said. But only Minnesota.

The MB document is a masterwork of prevarication

[MobileCabin]

Talking about B20, I just listened to this yesterday (check around 10:25 into video):


https://leisurevans.com/serenity/vid...eid=29655fa2be


Dean mentions that the new engine handles B20. I have not found any other source that goes into details. Is this just the same as now, meaning the engine can take B20 but just don't do it as a normal practice.

[ClassB]

The Winnebago ERA is 10's of thousands cheaper and yet has quality far superior to the three models you mentioned. Ask me how I know. Your going to pay well over a $120K for something that isn't worth more then $80K to begin with.

[Boxster1971]

Originally Posted by MobileCabin

Talking about B20, I just listened to this yesterday (check around 10:25 into video): ...
...
Dean mentions that the new engine handles B20. I have not found any other source that goes into details. Is this just the same as now, meaning the engine can take B20 but just don't do it as a normal practice.

That might be a 2019 Serenity, but it is built on a 2018 Sprinter. The 2018 Sprinter owners manual still has same cautions about using B20. But the wording has changed (see attached) to face the realities of B20 in USA.

[dhectorg]

Actually, if I was going to buy a (non-custom OEM) Sprinter class B today, it would be a Coachmen Galleria, mainly for their build quality and the Li3 battery/electrical system. PleasureWay would be my 2nd choice, for their superior build quality. Roadtrek's build quality is garbage in recent years. I wouldn't even consider them, especially given the fraud that has occurred at the company.

[Manx]

We love our Ascent. Never had a problem finding B5 diesel, but we have not taken it further West than Missouri.

Since you are 6'3", I strongly recommend trying out all the beds in the fully down position. You may find the Ascent bed a little short. Don't know about the other two.

[brianh]

I thought I'd revisit this topic and chime in with what we decided. It was a very interesting process, complicated in so small part by all of the goings-on with Roadtrek/EHGNA. Ultimately I decided on the Ascent. Finding one that I could buy and have in time for our Summer plans was a challenge, I ended up having to buy from a dealer many states away, but I'm very happy with my decision.

Here's how I ended up there:
We drove a 2019 Roadtrek Agile at my local dealer. Liked it a lot, but once we had decided that we needed the Sprinter chassis, I felt that we should be getting the benefits of Mercedes' safety options (blind spot assist, lane keeping, collision avoidance), which are an option package that's less than $2K additional on the Sprinter chassis. Seems like a no-brainer considering you're already having to pay $35K more than a comparable Promaster-based RV. But the one we drove didn't have that package, nor did the others available at other dealers within a few hundred miles of us. The only ones that did were the Agile 4x4 models, which would add another $9,000 to the price for an option we had no need of.

That lead me to look at the other manufacturers who build on the short Sprinter chassis. We quickly ruled out the Winnebego Revel and its off-road focus. That left us with the three models I posted this thread about. As I noted early, I ruled out the Airstream Interstate 19 after seeing it in person because it's really short on storage space. It's beautiful, and if it had the same storage as the Ascent, I may have sprung for it despite the high cost. So it was down to Ascent vs. Agile.

The Ascent won in most categories for us. I like the layout better, the lighting and control panel is better, and the overall level of quality just seemed much higher. And of course the manufacturer isn't in limbo in terms of their future. In the Agile's corner was higher specs for the battery/solar, an interior design that we actually liked a bit better, and their bed is spec'ed at 3 inches longer. That last part might have been enough to tilt us toward the Agile. The bed on the Ascent is too short for my 6-3 frame to fit comfortably without angling myself so that my feet can hang off in the middle portion of the bed. If those extra 3" the Agile claims to have would have allowed me to fit more comfortably, it might have won out. But when I tried it, it didn't really feel all that different. If those 3" were real and not a difference in how they measure, then it wasn't enough to make a difference. Once I had tried both beds within 30 minute of each other, the choice of the Ascent was an easy one.

Thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread, and to a number of other threads on this forum that have discussed these models and Roadtrek and Pleasure-Way in general. It was enormously helpful and I feel so much more confident in this major purchase than I would have without all these valuable insights. I'll do my best to pay it back with contributions of my own.

[Keyne]

Originally Posted by brianh

I thought I'd revisit this topic and chime in with what we decided. It was a very interesting process, complicated in so small part by all of the goings-on with Roadtrek/EHGNA. Ultimately I decided on the Ascent. Finding one that I could buy and have in time for our Summer plans was a challenge, I ended up having to buy from a dealer many states away, but I'm very happy with my decision.

Here's how I ended up there:
We drove a 2019 Roadtrek Agile at my local dealer. Liked it a lot, but once we had decided that we needed the Sprinter chassis, I felt that we should be getting the benefits of Mercedes' safety options (blind spot assist, lane keeping, collision avoidance), which are an option package that's less than $2K additional on the Sprinter chassis. Seems like a no-brainer considering you're already having to pay $35K more than a comparable Promaster-based RV. But the one we drove didn't have that package, nor did the others available at other dealers within a few hundred miles of us. The only ones that did were the Agile 4x4 models, which would add another $9,000 to the price for an option we had no need of.

That lead me to look at the other manufacturers who build on the short Sprinter chassis. We quickly ruled out the Winnebego Revel and its off-road focus. That left us with the three models I posted this thread about. As I noted early, I ruled out the Airstream Interstate 19 after seeing it in person because it's really short on storage space. It's beautiful, and if it had the same storage as the Ascent, I may have sprung for it despite the high cost. So it was down to Ascent vs. Agile.

The Ascent won in most categories for us. I like the layout better, the lighting and control panel is better, and the overall level of quality just seemed much higher. And of course the manufacturer isn't in limbo in terms of their future. In the Agile's corner was higher specs for the battery/solar, an interior design that we actually liked a bit better, and their bed is spec'ed at 3 inches longer. That last part might have been enough to tilt us toward the Agile. The bed on the Ascent is too short for my 6-3 frame to fit comfortably without angling myself so that my feet can hang off in the middle portion of the bed. If those extra 3" the Agile claims to have would have allowed me to fit more comfortably, it might have won out. But when I tried it, it didn't really feel all that different. If those 3" were real and not a difference in how they measure, then it wasn't enough to make a difference. Once I had tried both beds within 30 minute of each other, the choice of the Ascent was an easy one.

Thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread, and to a number of other threads on this forum that have discussed these models and Roadtrek and Pleasure-Way in general. It was enormously helpful and I feel so much more confident in this major purchase than I would have without all these valuable insights. I'll do my best to pay it back with contributions of my own.

Congratulations! The Ascent is really nice. We ended up buying a 2017 RT Agile and have been really happy with our choice (wanted all electric/diesel and the dealers are closer for service 1 hour vs. 5 hours). Interesting that the 2019 RT Agile's dont have the MB safety features. Our Agile has the features (blind spot assist, lane assist, etc.). Surprised to hear the 2019's didn't. Have fun and enjoy the new van!

[brianh]

Originally Posted by Keyne

Congratulations! The Ascent is really nice. We ended up buying a 2017 RT Agile and have been really happy with our choice (wanted all electric/diesel and the dealers are closer for service 1 hour vs. 5 hours). Interesting that the 2019 RT Agile's dont have the MB safety features. Our Agile has the features (blind spot assist, lane assist, etc.). Surprised to hear the 2019's didn't. Have fun and enjoy the new van!

Some 2019's do have those features, others do not. I was really surprised to learn this. As I looked around at new Agile inventory around the country via RVT, I could see that all of the 4x4 models had the safety features, while most of the 2WD models did not. But I did find a handful of 2019's that did have them. It's easy to tell because the package that includes those features also includes steering wheel controls for the audio and bluetooth. The ones without that package have a plain steering wheel.

What I found bothersome is that Roadtrek's pricing was no different. They don't show this package as an option at all, and the MSRP sheets reflect the same base price whether or not the safety features are included. My guess is that they baked the cost of this option package into their pricing for all of their Sprinter models, and either because of supply issues with Mercedes or simply to cut their costs, they started building Agiles on the base chassis. Regardless of the reason, I think it's pretty lame that they are pricing them the same and not passing at least some of the savings to their customers. Had I not done my research, I'd have never realized that I would be getting less for the same price than buyers in other locales for the same product.

[Keyne]

Originally Posted by brianh

Some 2019's do have those features, others do not. I was really surprised to learn this. As I looked around at new Agile inventory around the country via RVT, I could see that all of the 4x4 models had the safety features, while most of the 2WD models did not. But I did find a handful of 2019's that did have them. It's easy to tell because the package that includes those features also includes steering wheel controls for the audio and bluetooth. The ones without that package have a plain steering wheel.

What I found bothersome is that Roadtrek's pricing was no different. They don't show this package as an option at all, and the MSRP sheets reflect the same base price whether or not the safety features are included. My guess is that they baked the cost of this option package into their pricing for all of their Sprinter models, and either because of supply issues with Mercedes or simply to cut their costs, they started building Agiles on the base chassis. Regardless of the reason, I think it's pretty lame that they are pricing them the same and not passing at least some of the savings to their customers. Had I not done my research, I'd have never realized that I would be getting less for the same price than buyers in other locales for the same product.

It is surprising. I wonder if it was a van shortage issue as you mentioned. I thought all RT Sprinters had the same features so surprised to see they were different. We ordered one of the last RT's that were available with specific options before the "package" ordering that was setup. For instance, I have 4 AGM batteries, diesel Alde, underhood generator, spare tire underneath, and NO volt start. I am really glad we have the setup that we have and were told we were the last to not have volt start. I am glad with the current RT company issues that we don't have their proprietary lithiums or volt start.

Anyway, I wonder if other changes were made to how they order vans and options that are different from when we ordered. I do really like having the blind spot assist. I turn the lane assist off but the blind spot assist is great. One thing that was rare on our van as well is that we have the factory high idle adjustment button. Its great for adjusting to a high idle to charge the batteries or run the roof top AC when not plugged in.

[Maverick]

Originally Posted by michaeln416

My wife and I had the exact same short list and had the opportunity to see all three at the Toronto RV Show last week. All three were very impressive. The Airstream definitely gave you the "flying first class" experience, but was out of our price range and clashes with our hiking boots and cargo shorts wardrobe. The RoadTrek's layout felt backwards to us both for driving and camping. We prefer the passenger side windows open to view while on the road, and we want to see into our campsite while cooking. Therefore, for us, it was an easy decision to go with Pleasure-Way. Right now we are debating between two of their models, trying to decide if we can fit in the Ascent or go one size larger with the Plateau.

Good input. What model did you eventually go with? Thanks.

[Davydd]

Michaeln416, I first had a Pleasure-way and two more Bs pretty much based on my original Plateau design. Your impressions hit the nail on the head with my first impressions of Class Bs. I like the Ascent which is pretty much a stripped down version of the Plateau but you get the short, nimble 2500 body which I now have a it is a dream compared to the 3500 duallies longer bodies. If you think you can fit what you perceive carrying in a B, I would get it.

We are only 2,500 miles in on our new 2500 short Sprinter chassis but have found everywhere we turn a major difference about where and how we go from parking just about anywhere without thinking where first, making U turns, just getting fuel at a service station and just familiar places we had to avoid before with a longer van.

That new Pleasure-way Recon is interesting but I have never felt a need for a 4x4 in our travel style but I think it will be an answer to that style of off-grid travel. Also, it is a tad spartan for touring but better for activity destinations. I do like the cab area and full turn around seating.

Edit: Oh well, I see Maverick was responding to a 2019 post. Forget it. My impressions now of a short Sprinter is still grit for discussion.

[rowiebowie]

Originally Posted by Maverick

Good input. What model did you eventually go with? Thanks.

Welcome to the forum Maverick!

As mentioned, this is an older thread. The member you're asking only posted the one time and nothing in the over two years since, so it's highly unlikely you'll get a response.

But in general, I've heard little to no ill spoken of Pleasureway models. Their reputation is stellar.

[Maverick]

Originally Posted by Davydd

Michaeln416, I first had a Pleasure-way and two more Bs pretty much based on my original Plateau design. Your impressions hit the nail on the head with my first impressions of Class Bs. I like the Ascent which is pretty much a stripped down version of the Plateau but you get the short, nimble 2500 body which I now have a it is a dream compared to the 3500 duallies longer bodies. If you think you can fit what you perceive carrying in a B, I would get it.

We are only 2,500 miles in on our new 2500 short Sprinter chassis but have found everywhere we turn a major difference about where and how we go from parking just about anywhere without thinking where first, making U turns, just getting fuel at a service station and just familiar places we had to avoid before with a longer van.

That new Pleasure-way Recon is interesting but I have never felt a need for a 4x4 in our travel style but I think it will be an answer to that style of off-grid travel. Also, it is a tad spartan for touring but better for activity destinations. I do like the cab area and full turn around seating.

Edit: Oh well, I see Maverick was responding to a 2019 post. Forget it. My impressions now of a short Sprinter is still grit for discussion.

Your response was more helpful than you think. I am still deciding between a 144” versus either a 170” or even a 170” extended. While I love the extra space and conveniences in the longer ones, I also like the advantage of maneuverability of the shorter 144”. So still trying to make a final decision after weighing the trade-offs. You can’t have it all in one size

[Maverick]

Originally Posted by rowiebowie

Welcome to the forum Maverick!

As mentioned, this is an older thread. The member you're asking only posted the one time and nothing in the over two years since, so it's highly unlikely you'll get a response.

But in general, I've heard little to no ill spoken of Pleasureway models. Their reputation is stellar.

Thank you for your response! How do you stack the Pleasure Way (let’s say Ascent) with the Air Stream (let’s say Interstate 19) on quality, fit and finish? I do see one advantage with the PW - the Plateau has a size in between 19’5” and 24”6” (or so) that Air Stream offers. But if I only consider the shorty then it’s a clear head-to-head comparison. I have physically seen the AS I-19 but haven’t yet seen any PW yet.

I liked the layout and space use inside the Ascent. The one thing I did not like about the Ascent (from videos and pictures) is all the large venting for the fridge and heater. I am going for a heavier automotive styling and this is one area where the AI-19 was a clear winner. Lot less visible venting.

[rowiebowie]

Originally Posted by Maverick

Thank you for your response! How do you stack the Pleasure Way (let’s say Ascent) with the Air Stream (let’s say Interstate 19) on quality, fit and finish? I do see one advantage with the PW - the Plateau has a size in between 19’5” and 24”6” (or so) that Air Stream offers. But if I only consider the shorty then it’s a clear head-to-head comparison. I have physically seen the AS I-19 but haven’t yet seen any PW yet.

I liked the layout and space use inside the Ascent. The one thing I did not like about the Ascent (from videos and pictures) is all the large venting for the fridge and heater. I am going for a heavier automotive styling and this is one area where the AI-19 was a clear winner. Lot less visible venting.

I'm a member on airforums.com (Airstream forum) and I'm an owner of their short-lived Avenue line on the Chevy Express chassis. I see enough to know that Airstream class b's and trailers can be hit & miss. As mentioned earlier, almost no one complains about their Pleasureway.

To your question of vents on the Pleasureway Ascent. Those would be the vents for an absorption fridge. I agree Pleasureway was very late to switch to compressor fridges which are better and need no external vents.

Their reluctance to switch probably relates to wanting to provide increased boondocking time since an absorption fridge sips propane, while a compressor fridge uses the coach battery unless plugged in. But since Pleasureway was an early adoptor of 200Ah lithium batteries, that mitigates that concern.

Plus, it looks like Pleasureway swiched to compressor fridge in 2021.5 models so no longer has the big exterior wents.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kCtB6cz78bE

[Maverick]

Originally Posted by rowiebowie

I'm a member on airforums.com (Airstream forum) and I'm an owner of their short-lived Avenue line on the Chevy Express chassis. I see enough to know that Airstream class b's and trailers can be hit & miss. As mentioned earlier, almost no one complains about their Pleasureway.

To your question of vents on the Pleasureway Ascent. Those would be the vents for an absorption fridge. I agree Pleasureway was very late to switch to compressor fridges which are better and need no external vents.

Their reluctance to switch probably relates to wanting to provide increased boondocking time since an absorption fridge sips propane, while a compressor fridge uses the coach battery unless plugged in. But since Pleasureway was an early adoptor of 200Ah lithium batteries, that mitigates that concern.

Plus, it looks like Pleasureway swiched to compressor fridge in 2021.5 models so no longer has the big exterior wents.

Thank you. I did see today that their latest model is a big improvement on the fridge vents. If they improve the heater (?) vent as well, it would be close to the AI in external simplicity. I am a member in airforums as well, as I try to decide between various options. Looks like the PW is a more reliable one than AI. The Tommy Bahama interior is another attractive option I found with AI. But that’s not a deal breaker.