off the lot vs. special order

[rothskeller]

I went to a local PleasureWay dealer today to look at a new Ascent. The sales guy asked whether I expected to be buying off the lot, or placing a special order for the exact options I want (approx. 5 months lead time). I assumed that buying off the lot would be cheaper, but the sales guy said no, usually a special order is cheaper. That seemed really odd to me — certainly at variance with my experience purchasing regular cars. Of course I have considered that he might have been mistaken or inaccurate. But assuming he was speaking accurately, can anyone explain why a special order would be cheaper?

[Bruceper]

Someone has to pay for the vehicle sitting on the lot. In a typical dealership the vehicle is purchased by the dealer from the manufacturer and then financed. It sounds silly but that's how it works.

So the dealer is paying interest on the financing, financing fees to set up the loan, the up front cost of delivering the vehicle to the lot and other fees which are paid at the time of purchase. These are direct costs that will be transferred to the buyer. And on a $150,000 vehicle the interest isn't cheap.

So a special order won't have any financing to get in the way of a purchase, which reduces it's actual cost. Plus the dealer may be able to receive an incentive for a special order which they may pass part of it to you saving additional money.

Many of the above fees are still charged on a special order, but they are not financed. They are charged to the buyer directly in the form of dealer costs which they call things like freight, setup, PDI etc.

[avanti]

+1.

If you are paying more for special order, you aren't negotiating very well.

(Of course, the exception is a last-year vehicle that hasn't sold for which the dealer is eager to cut his or her losses).

[booster]

When we were looking for our Roadtrek in the 2007-2008 range, all the Roadtrek dealers we talked to wanted full sticker for a special order, so it easily got to the point that a fully optioned one on the lot cost less than the selectively optioned special order.

My guess is that it had to do with some sort of lack of floorplan from Roadtrek to help the dealers carry the inventory on their lots. If the dealers are paying 1-1.5% a month to have the unit on the lot, they quickly figure out that selling it cheaper is actually much better for the bottom line.

Things seem to be totally different now.

[rothskeller]

So, @Bruceper and @booster seem to be using the same data to reach opposite conclusions. There is a cost to the dealer to having a unit on the lot; that makes sense. @Bruceper says that means special order is cheaper because the dealer doesn't have to pay that cost. @booster says that means off the lot is cheaper because the dealer has more incentive to discount it.

I think what this means is that the dealer *can* sell a special order more cheaply, but has less incentive to do so. The *actual* sales price might be cheaper for off the lot because the dealer has more incentive to move it. Have I got that about right?

[Bruceper]

Originally Posted by rothskeller

I think what this means is that the dealer *can* sell a special order more cheaply, but has less incentive to do so. The *actual* sales price might be cheaper for off the lot because the dealer has more incentive to move it. Have I got that about right?

Sounds about right.

The other thing mentioned is incentives. Sometimes the manufacturer gives an incentive to sell "old" units such as last years models that are still kicking around.

[avanti]

My experience is that vehicle dealers vary widely with respect to pricing. They simply have different business models. I recently bought a new car. It was a new model in relatively short supply. My local dealer didn't have what I wanted, and said my only option was to place a factory order and wait 5 months. That evening, I got on the Internet. I found at least 10 identical units that were exactly what I was looking for, all within 500 miles of home. I sent email to all of them. Many of them said that their price was MSRP, period. I ended up buying from a South Carolina dealer who delivered my exact vehicle to our driveway in less than a week for almost $5K below list. They were a class act. Clearly they were set up for this kind of volume sale, whereas many others preferred higher profits on fewer units. I don't have enough experience to know if this is true in the RV market, but I bet it is.

[Willie_B]

I put a deposit down on a 2018 Ascent 2 weeks ago. Dealer was asking same price for unit on lot or one of their yet to be built allotments. The one on the lot sold while we were looking so we ordered one. Delivery hopefully in May.

You can PM me if you want to talk price we got.

[Bud]

Maybe this needs to be in a different thread, but maybe here is ok too?

"off the lot vs. special order" Could there be a difference in trying to ensure the B did not have problems that the dealer might not fix for months?

Bud

[Saldar]

An RV on the lot may have options you don't want. Paying for extras complicates figuring the "value" of what you get.

Our dealer let us dicker on a custom order WBO.

We decide what is a "decent" deal and then try to stop thinking about it. Buying is painful, but hopefully what you go home with will be fun so you can forget about it.

[avanti]

Originally Posted by Saldar

An RV on the lot may have options you don't want. Paying for extras complicates figuring the "value" of what you get.

That is a good point. In the long run, owning just what you want is worth a lot.

[booster]

Originally Posted by Bud

Maybe this needs to be in a different thread, but maybe here is ok too?

"off the lot vs. special order" Could there be a difference in trying to ensure the B did not have problems that the dealer might not fix for months?

Bud

That is a good point for on the lot units. Many of them that have been there a while likely have batteries that are in poor condition, both coach and engine, due to sitting without use or charge. The units with AGM will be a quite a bit better off than wet cells as the self discharge is lower, but the dealers often seem to leave stuff on after showing the unit and kill them completely. Our batteries were bad right off the lot and had to be replaced within 3 weeks, of course the dealer, Exide, and Roadtrek all refused to do them under warranty even though the rig was sold only 3 weeks earlier, because it was a model year old and on the lot a while. Lithium units would likely not have issues because they shut off (in good systems) before they go dead and get damaged. They could have issues in the very cold north from going below the -4*F, though.

[jrobe]

If you are waiting 5 months to get a special order Class B, the other option is to wait just a little longer and get exactly what you want with a Sportsmobile van. I was close to ordering a PW Ascent but didn't like a few things like the LP generator, LP refrigerator, no spare tire, no second alternator, etc.. It took me about 10 months to get a custom made Sportsmobile exactly the way I wanted it and for almost exactly the same price. The build quality is top notch and every bit as good as a Pleasureway and far above a Roadtrek or Winnebago. I also got a 1 year newer Sprinter model.

[rothskeller]

Sportsmobile's current build time is 14 months, according to them. Yes, I am certainly considering that option as well.

[mumkin]

All three of my rigs were special ordered. The ones on the lot NEVER have the options that I want... usually they have much more than I want. And it was cheaper to special order.

My next rig will also be special order too... negotiations have started for next summer delivery.

[BBQ]

.

When the economy is good, and people have plenty of disposable income,
the dealers want to keep the stock units for the impulse buyers. Because they can be sold for a premium.

[mlts22]

I'm going with Sportsmobile myself, most likely. Around 85-90k gets me exactly what I want, with a decent floorplan, custom power system, Truma heater/water heater, HEHR or Seitz windows, and other items. A few years back, Sportsmobile and custom makers were expensive, but with how prices have shot up, they are a viable alternative.

[Technomadness]

FYI MHSRV.com in Texas lists everything they carry at %25 off MSRP to begin with.

Dealers like to pretend that MSRP is the price but even more than with cars, RVs have a lot of room for discounting, as dealers will use this to manipulate buyers when they want to close.

I understand that dealers can discount up to %40 and still make a good profit.

One strategy is to figure out what you want and then email all the dealers (don’t give them your phone number) asking for their best price. Then take the top price and email the rest with it asking them if the can beat it.

On a special order they should because they gave no costs, and even a $500 profit is better than losing the sale. You will often find that dealers further away give you better prices while dealers near you think they gave an advantage— so even better if you don’t give away your location.

This basically forces them to compete for your business.

For best results send your email to the sales manager, not a salesman. Salesman want to protect their commission— the sales manager gets a bonus based on total sales.


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[jrobe]

One good option with Sportsmobile (at least Sportsmobile North) is to buy the van yourself from Freightliner. My Freightliner dealer had better access to vans than the MB dealers.

With the difficult recent availability of Sprinters, especially 4x4's (which a fairly high percentage of Sportsmobile buyers prefer), Sportsmobile is frequently waiting for their vans to arrive. I was on a 12 month waiting list for a Sportsmobile build but got my Freightliner van in in 8 months when they moved me up as they were waiting for vans to arrive that were ordered before mine.

Good luck getting a Roadtrek or Pleasureway RV for 25-40% off. The market is good enough that there are buyers willing to pay far more than that.

[mumkin]

Originally Posted by jrobe

Good luck getting a Roadtrek or Pleasureway RV for 25-40% off. The market is good enough that there are buyers willing to pay far more than that.

I agree. Not a chance... they have always been sold at 12-18% off MSRP. Winnebago has long been 25-30% off. With the current demand for the Leisure Travel small Class C's you will very likely get 0% discount and still have to wait over 10 months to get one.