Mercedes Chassis/Engine Changes through the Years

[Marley]

We are looking at some used Sprinter vans because the C$ is at such a disadvantage right now. Since it is our first B maybe we will try a lower priced one out first.

What are the changes MB made through the years? particularly what was in the 2006 models? 5 cylinder?

Looking at a GW Van from that year. Any issues to be concerned with?

[bobojay]

The 2006 chassis was the last of the T1N Sprinters. 5 cyl engine is excellent with a couple small easily fixable issues. The weak point of the T1N chassis van is rust, so watch out for that.
2007 started the NCV3 Sprinter with the V6 engines. Nothing wrong with that engine itself, but there's way more emissions equipment on it that can & has caused issues.
Hope this helped...

[InterBlog]

We have a T1N Sprinter (2006) and we love it. Very simple, with a short list of known problems (one of which is the turbo-resonator which is a 20-minute fix). We've owned ours for about 26 months, put on about 15K miles in that time, and have had zero problems (the Airstream upfit portion of the van is another story... we've had a basket of problems with that). Given that it's an older, simpler engine, it costs seven bucks for an annual state inspection. There are no emissions tests.

I do most of my reading and posting over on the Air Forums B-Van subforum, and there is a steady stream of complaints about the emissions system on the NCV3 Sprinter. It's apparently not a foolproof operation of simply adding DEF and forgetting about it. This piece published by a self-professed fleet owner of 47 Sprinters describes his opinion on the emissions systems problems.

I have not heard any rust-related complaints pertaining to the T1N chassis. Both my husband and I have spent many hours underneath ours, working on DIY projects, and have noticed no degradation of any kind in the chassis. For Sprinter upfits where the skin of the vehicle has been cut to include appurtenances, yes, there have been rust issues reported where the job was poorly done. But our 10-year-old chassis looks fine. Its first owner did live in an area of the country where they salt the roads.

[Marley]

Originally Posted by bobojay

The 2006 chassis was the last of the T1N Sprinters. 5 cyl engine is excellent with a couple small easily fixable issues. The weak point of the T1N chassis van is rust, so watch out for that.
2007 started the NCV3 Sprinter with the V6 engines. Nothing wrong with that engine itself, but there's way more emissions equipment on it that can & has caused issues.
Hope this helped...

Thanks. Just what I was looking for.
Where were the rust issues in particular?
Also any thoughts on Great West Vans in general?

[avanti]

Originally Posted by Marley

Where were the rust issues in particular?
Also any thoughts on Great West Vans in general?

Many people believe that the MB rust issues were limited to the basic white paint job, typically ordered for delivery vans. Most of the upfitters order premium paint. We owned an Airstream Interstate built on a 2004 T1N for a decade (with premium paint). The only rust issues were those caused by Airstream's ham-handed construction techniques. Note that you can't assume the basic paint job just because the van is white--there were and are premium whites available as well. The basic white has no clear-coat. Also, note that MB claims to have improved their paint/rust-protecdtion process starting in MY2014.

Great West (now out of business) had a generally excellent reputation for quality over the years. We love our 2014.

[BBQ]

.

This is a T1N. 500,000 miles and going strong.

Unfortunately the Youtube video is no longer available.

[bobojay]

Originally Posted by Marley

Thanks. Just what I was looking for.
Where were the rust issues in particular?
Also any thoughts on Great West Vans in general?

The usual bottoms of the doors, rockers etc. The unusual spot is around the windshield. If the windshield glass has ever been changed, usually rust starts pretty quick because it gets scratched down under the glass edges when the old glass sealer gets cut out. Look for that.
We know a couple with a 2004 T1N Pleasureway that have 200k on it with the driveshaft and struts being the only mechanical issues. Those were wear items. They've had rust issues in the places I mentioned above. Recently they spent $7k on it for a full rust repair and full body re-paint job.

Great West used to have a very good reputation for quality units....

[mkguitar]

Originally Posted by Marley

We are looking at some used Sprinter vans because the C$ ...

Suggest that with the rust a concern you stay away from anything Eastern.

I'm assuming that a 'commercial' vehicle isn;t held to same rust standards as passenger vehicles.

Pay attention to any areas that have been "worked" in an RV conversion.
Rust is very rare in AZ, I have a neighbor with a 99 Ford PW Excel and he has bad at the top corners of the rear doors, where the wide body modification attaches. Seen similar on other widebody models



Mike

[Marley]

2006 Great West Van with 20,000 miles. 30th Anniversary Edition.
Like new condition. Approx US$55k. Sold before I could get to look at it.
Not sure what they were worth new but seemed reasonable if I could have got it for under US$50k.

[bobojay]

Marley, these days any T1N based class B RV needs to be snatched up ASAP or you'll lose out as your experience shows.
As long as you can confirm the rust issue not being in there....

[Davydd]

The sticker price for a 2006 would have been in the high $70K at the time. As you can imagine the T1Ns hold their value.

[InterBlog]

Originally Posted by Marley

2006 Great West Van with 20,000 miles. 30th Anniversary Edition.
Like new condition. Approx US$55k. Sold before I could get to look at it.
Not sure what they were worth new but seemed reasonable if I could have got it for under US$50k.

For that unit as described, I think you'd be hard pressed to get it under $50K. I'm not as familiar with non-Airstream models, but if anything, in the past couple of years, T1N Airstream Interstates in excellent condition seem to have gone up in price rather than down. Certainly the asks have gone up, and I'd imagine the agreed sales prices are also somewhat up.

[Marley]

Originally Posted by InterBlog

For that unit as described, I think you'd be hard pressed to get it under $50K. I'm not as familiar with non-Airstream models, but if anything, in the past couple of years, T1N Airstream Interstates in excellent condition seem to have gone up in price rather than down. Certainly the asks have gone up, and I'd imagine the agreed sales prices are also somewhat up.

The unit is still for sale. Looking at it today. If all checks out I will make an offer.

Anyone know what ASR does on a 2006? Is it just traction control or is it also stability control (i.e. sway in windy conditions etc)

[Boxster1971]

http://sprinter-source.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6147

"ASR limits free spin of an axle shaft via brake application friction on the outboard end of the axle.

The end result, drive restoration of the non spinning axle, is the same- but ASR does this without the typical disadvantages of a conventional mechanical limited slip. Those being- noise, expensive wear and tear of internal components, and adverse handling effects during hard cornering.

ASR can also assist when both rear wheels lose traction by inducing torque reduction and controlled frictional arrest of both axle shafts. Doktor A"


- - Mike
2012 Sprinter 3500 Extended converted B-Van by Airstream

[Marley]

Originally Posted by InterBlog

For that unit as described, I think you'd be hard pressed to get it under $50K. I'm not as familiar with non-Airstream models, but if anything, in the past couple of years, T1N Airstream Interstates in excellent condition seem to have gone up in price rather than down. Certainly the asks have gone up, and I'd imagine the agreed sales prices are also somewhat up.

Originally Posted by Boxster1971

What is ASR? - Sprinter-Forum

"ASR limits free spin of an axle shaft via brake application friction on the outboard end of the axle.

The end result, drive restoration of the non spinning axle, is the same- but ASR does this without the typical disadvantages of a conventional mechanical limited slip. Those being- noise, expensive wear and tear of internal components, and adverse handling effects during hard cornering.

ASR can also assist when both rear wheels lose traction by inducing torque reduction and controlled frictional arrest of both axle shafts. Doktor A"


- - Mike
2012 Sprinter 3500 Extended converted B-Van by Airstream

So essentially yes - but the rig would have to have a lot of sway to kick in.

[InterBlog]

Originally Posted by Marley

The unit is still for sale. Looking at it today. If all checks out I will make an offer.

Anyone know what ASR does on a 2006? Is it just traction control or is it also stability control (i.e. sway in windy conditions etc)

On a 2006, I'm not sure that this was a standard feature. We have a button labeled as such in our 2006, but I think it's just there in case it needed to be added electively. So you might check carefully the unit that you are in the process of examining.

[Marley]

One (?) more question...

Rig has Onan LP genset built in but only has 7.5 hours on meter. What could be issues if it hasn't been run/exercised regularly over the past 9 years?

[Davydd]

Originally Posted by Marley

One (?) more question...

Rig has Onan LP genset built in but only has 7.5 hours on meter. What could be issues if it hasn't been run/exercised regularly over the past 9 years?

The whole van has sat unused. 20,000 miles represents a mere 2,000 miles per year. That means it has sat most of the time unless they were using it regularly to run a mile or two down the road for snacks. That latter could be very bad. The former means it just sat good or bad depending on the conditions it sat in. If it just sat then they weren't exercising the generator either and you can bet on that. The proof is have them start the generator up with you being there and see how it runs. After, did it fire and start right up? Did it stay running with various loads? Rest it. Do it again. In exercise theory, and no other use, that generator should have 2 hrs x 12 mo x 10 yrs = 240 hours minimum. Seriously though, that is way overblown for a propane generator. I can personally attest to that. I rarely used my generators that I had in two Bs and 125,000 miles and only tested them before starting out on a major trip just to make sure they were OK. Not once did they ever not start and run smoothly.

I would be concerned about the tires. They could look great with only 20,000 miles but they would be 10 years old and way overdue to be replaced. Same goes with hoses or anything with a rubber compound that holds air or liquid because they never got normal wear or maintenance. I'm going on the assumption that like most RVs they got the most use (miles) when new and since sat.

My Bs never sat much. My experience on this was a vintage Airstream trailer I bought that had been used as a backyard guest room for the previous 8 years.

[B Eventually]

Originally Posted by Marley

One (?) more question...

Rig has Onan LP genset built in but only has 7.5 hours on meter. What could be issues if it hasn't been run/exercised regularly over the past 9 years?

I believe LP genset's are the best at surviving infrequent use. Onan repairs can be pricey. If our Gas Onan ever gives us trouble, I'm probably going to yank it in favor of a second alternator. I've already done the lithium and inverter upgrades, but can't justify tossing a perfectly functioning, nearly new generator.

[avanti]

Originally Posted by Transit

If our Gas Onan ever gives us trouble, I'm probably going to yank it in favor of a second alternator. I've already done the lithium and inverter upgrades, but can't justify tossing a perfectly functioning, nearly new generator.

I have both a propane genset and a second alternator. I just DARE the Onan to give me an excuse to pull it.