Looking for our First Class B

[funfyzics]

Hello
We have decided to take the plunge and get a Class B! So far our short list includes: Travato K (gets more expensive every year), Thor Sequence, Thor Tellaro( Seems Thor is trying to undersell Winnebago) and maybe PleasureWay Toffino.
If you have any toughts, suggestions or experiences with any of these, my wife will bake you brownies or I will!(you're better off with hers!)

Thanks
Brian

[mkguitar]

I have an older Pleasure Way on a gas Chev ( fixable , by anyone, anywhere with parts from NAPA)

what I will suggest is watch sales videos on youtube carefully. watch how the sales guy ( often large) moves around the cabin

watch for things like having to move something to access something else

think about the bed, sideways sleepers are limited by the width of the van ( and require a climb over to use the can)
motorized sofas can be a tetris of cushions and the weight and complication of the motor device and the lack of storage under, could be a concern

cabinetry floor to ceiling/ over hanging can be claustrophobic

see as many models as you can

read up on the "van" part of the vehicle for reliability and do parts come from Germany or Italy? dealer service only? do dealers have lifts or bays with clearance for an RV or are you going to the "truck dept"


balancing energy use is crucial whether propane, AC or DC power- I'd stay away from newer unproven technologies
I read about some of that stuff and shake my head


simple and known systems can be serviced anywhere

research the dealer ( if using one) are warranties being resolved in an acceptable manner
( neighbor with new RV has had multiple warranty issues- each taking months at dealer - no use of RV)


Cheers, Mike

[funfyzics]

Great ideas thank you

[mkguitar]

the more you question the better-


the gas chev decision was strongly driven ( ha!) by my ownership of gm pick up and commonalities in the drivetrain, manual and tools. I buy most of my gas at costco when traveling helps on costs. we can count on 15 or 16 mpg


I rented a citroen version of the travato in Ireland- diesel/ 6 speed- it was good
was way hot on buying a 2010 sprinter winnebago era- the sprinter drove just great- the winnie build quality was horrendous


we looked at a few roadtreks, a rialta ( still like them) and a chinook


when we found our van ( used, private sale) we knew enough from the other RV's that we were close on each of our priorities


like we only need 2 seat (swivels up front) that opens up alot of space. the rear converts to an "almost" king


the propane 2 burner, furnace and water heater mean we have lots of energy when in the boonies


the 3 way fridge - propane is best and will make cold, AC is ok and DC will maintain cool while driving- benefits from added fan kits ( many threads on this)


I converted all the incandescent lights to warm LEDS- consumption is 1/10th what it was, light quality is nice.

changed the old tv to a samsung from costco which is native 14 volt DC


we have only the microwave and the roof A/C which require AC power- these might get used when on shore power.
We have a generator and have never used it while camping...noisy. I keep it maintained just in case


we also have an outdoor shower wand we use in the boonies- good for muddy boots or dog and cleaning fish



buying a used van in AZ means no sales tax- a 9% saving right there, my seller also had a mis-spelling in his ad which would not return his ad in search results. after following his ad 3 months the price dropped near reasonable and we agreed on a price
( he was in a HOA and his off site storage space lease was coming up)



search common mis-spellings RoadTrek or Road Trek also seen as RoadTrac, Roadtrak etc


The private purchase requires cash in hand- which can temper excitement and lead to a more financially sound choice


cheers!


Mike

[funfyzics]

Thanks again

[MN1]

Have you looked at the Crossfit/Beyond from Coachmen?

[Scottbaldassari]

"Travato K (gets more expensive every year)"; True, and Winnebago usually adds features requested by the owner base every year also. Keep in mind that Winnebagos list prices are easily 30% high, with many owners reporting discounts as high as 36% off MSRP. Join the Travato Facebook group for more information and (mostly) glowing product reviews.

"Thor Sequence, Thor Tellaro( Seems Thor is trying to undersell Winnebago)": They are; see the above. The name says it all. Join the Thor groups to get an idea of their product quality; spoiler alert - it is different than Winnebago.

"and maybe PleasureWay Toffino." Pleasureway is know for building a quality product, but the Toffino is a different animal from the other vans above. It is on the smaller, cheaper chassis, and has no bathroom - it is more of a weekender than a real class B camper. If you are interested in the smaller chassis, you may want to look at the Solis by Winnebago, which also has a pop-top, but does have a small bathroom with a cassette toilet.


Good luck with your decision!

[bobojay]

Agree with Scott above entirely. The Pleasureway the OP mentioned is more of a conversion van than a class B rv. No bathroom. But excellent build quality.

Someone mentioned above the 2010 Winnebago ERA. They were bad, but then again, they were built by a contractor, not WGO. Sold very poorly.

We have a 2019 Travato K model. Like Scott said above, they do get more expensive every year, but do have added features every year that are asked for by owners. They sell every one they make, but again, the street price is anywhere from 29-31% off list. Ours, after 2+ years and 27k miles is pretty much worth what we paid for it (31% off list when purchased). So far (knock on wood) we have only had 2 small problems with it. An interior finish oops, and a cracked fitting going into the Truma hot water heater which was easily and quickly fixed

[Rapid Robert]

Originally Posted by funfyzics

Hello
We have decided to take the plunge and get a Class B! So far our short list includes: Travato K (gets more expensive every year), Thor Sequence, Thor Tellaro( Seems Thor is trying to undersell Winnebago) and maybe PleasureWay Toffino.
If you have any toughts, suggestions or experiences with any of these, my wife will bake you brownies or I will!(you're better off with hers!)

Thanks
Brian

We had a 2007 Pleasureway Luxor and it was a great van, very high quality build and big tow capacity The only issues were overheating (we live in southern AZ) and brake issues on steep mountain grades, the front discs would warp when overheated and it felt like the wheels were falling off. I would like to think that they have fixed these issues by now.
We had a 2018 Travato K that we felt was fantastic in almost every way and made trips from coast to coast, lots of mountain driving. We added a swing away trunk on the rear hitch made by Rola to carry more stuff. We got the Travato new in 2018 with every option available at that time except the roof rack for $85k OTD. In 2 years we put 15,000 miles on it without one issue and I drove it fairly hard. I loved to drive it, handled great, was comfortable, and took side winds better then some cars I have had. On one trip from AZ to Key West we ran into some very bad weather around tornadoes with very high winds from El Paso to Miss. so I know from experience. It will handle side winds better then the printer which I have also had experience driving in wind.
I will say in Arizona the 15K A/C unit may not keep up in the hottest part of summer and is very noisy but the dash air never let us down! Not a lot of insulation in any of these B vans

[bobojay]

The 2021 Travato has a lot more insulation than the pre 2020s. It also has a much quieter coach AC unit, the new Coleman Mach 10 NDQ.
Yes they are more expensive, but you can buy a new one for about what the above poster paid for their 2018 without much searching around....

[jgmarcotte]

Originally Posted by funfyzics

Hello
We have decided to take the plunge and get a Class B! So far our short list includes: Travato K (gets more expensive every year), Thor Sequence, Thor Tellaro( Seems Thor is trying to undersell Winnebago) and maybe PleasureWay Toffino.
If you have any toughts, suggestions or experiences with any of these, my wife will bake you brownies or I will!(you're better off with hers!)

Thanks
Brian

If you are looking for new, look at Panoramicrv.com, available in the us very nice design completely different with the European look very well made.

[Ray B]

Of the Class B's funfyzics mentions, the pick is Travato. Too much of a quality decline in a Thor product - that is why they cost less. Although I'm a huge Pleasure-Way fan, the Tofino is a camping van where you have to go into the woods to do your business.

It scares me a little to hear him say, "gets more expensive every year." This implies buying new to me, which I don't think is a smart way to buy an RV. Our only new RV in 25 years of RVing was a Pleasure-Way (not the one we have now) which had excellent quality superior to Winnebago (we've also owned two of those), and it had so many little problems that I drove it from Las Vegas to Saskatoon to get them all fixed. The other major issue with new is financial. Depreciation should be a large consideration with new. Class B's don't depreciate like other classes of RV's but it is still a cost to consider.

I like the idea of getting a non-Sprinter RV as well. Too many problems and expenses.

Good Luck funfyzics!

Ray Brown
2012 Pleasure-Way Plateau TD
Ormond-by-the-Sea, Florida

[Storysrvwego]

My Travato 59K has been the epitomy of perfection. Three very minor issues out the gate which were all taken care of by me. Since then, one small rattle came up which was the microwave face, vibrating on the cabinet. I added a rubber seal.

Price increases? Everyone RV manufacturer will have that at least once a year. Some of this depends on their supplier cost increases which includes the chassis used. FCA RAM Promaster of course for the Travato but same applies to the coaches integrated into the FORD Transits and MERCEDES Sprinters. I think generally we see price bumps at the new model year change. Bear in mind a current model year RV may be built on a previous year chassis so a 2022 Travato for example, might be 2020 coach and 2019 chassis. if you feel you have to have the chassis of the same year as the coach build out, then you may have to wait until production continues with a new batch. Unless there were changes that you feel you need, or want, the mix of the chassis VIN date and the coach serial number is not an issue.

Using the MSRP of the 2018 59K versus a comparably equipped 2020, a quicky price check difference looks like about 7 percent a year. I only picked one 2020 model online to compare with the MSRP of my 2018 but this seems about the common change you will see in most cars, trucks, tractors, etc. Once in a blue moon a model will stay the same price in the next year. Costs probably went up. Possibly the manufacturer accepts a bit less profit in the new year to boost sales over the competition, while they are busy retooling for updates? You cannot predict. Just figure the next year will be 5% or more than the previous year with the same product.

In the case of the Travato's. there have been changes, some of which based on owner feedback. Some of which needed to be done. Windows for example. My wife and I bought a new 2018 that was still available when the 2019's were beginning to be stocked. We much prefer the larger all opening glass windows in our model. I think the change to smaller all opening glass AND dual paned acrylic windows was due to using common cutouts for the acrylic option which were not available in the larger size the glass windows were using. You get about the same square inches of window either way but we just preferred glass in the larger size of the 2018 coach. The down size which we were already aware of is the MCS window shades in the extra wide size used on ours are nearly worthless for winding themselves up. Oh they will. Depends on ambient temperature mostly. Sometimes we have to give them a light upward push if you want them fully retracted in the same millineum. We are familiar with this brand of shade in smaller widths and they work fine. The wide ones used in this case are a stretch of the design, regardless of how you adjust the mechanism per factory instructions. Minor issue. But the new Travatos improved the shade design with a completely new surround with wonderfully integrated shades that work super. The reality here is the 2019+ Travatos have better glass or acrylic optional windows and shade systems; likely added to cost but a very nice improvement even if my wife and I still prefer the older, larger windows. THOR?

THOR uses RAM factory glass windows that provide the sleekest exterior look. But most of them do not open. I am sure these windows which are factory installed by FCA in much larger numbers than the WB conversion would cost less. No labor at THOR to put up templates to cut out window openings, order in windows, install them, etc. The downside might be less outdoor air circulation in some areas of the coach. Perhaps leading to higher condensation issues for those that are in more humid locations or use the RV in winter. There are a a lot of factors here including dryer winter air more typical in the west (but not always!), placement and use of fans, insulation, etc. But the main thing is the cost was probably cheaper for THOR, thus a slice of the price differential between WB and THOR products. Even with some really nifty adds that THOR provided, overall it's got some cost cutting areas that help it to be a more attractive price point. Nothing wrong with that! Just have to study on an individual basis to see if the product and the manufacturer checks your boxes.

Would I get another new Travato today if I needed a new one? Based on experience and life with the one we have, you betcha. Do I worry about resale value. No. While Class B's tend to retain better value vs Class C and A models, this is not a point fret over. Plenty of other things to keep our minds busy. We budget in our retirement travels including the costs of the RV without any expectation of money back. Like a hotel/motel stay is just money out the door but if we enjoyed our travels with somewhat similar costs with the RV, then that is good enough return for us. I cannot dispute that others will have a different viewpoint. Nothing wrong with that. This is just how my wife and I go down the road.

[NFRicaS]

Originally Posted by mkguitar

I have an older Pleasure Way on a gas Chev ( fixable , by anyone, anywhere with parts from NAPA)

what I will suggest is watch sales videos on youtube carefully. watch how the sales guy ( often large) moves around the cabin

watch for things like having to move something to access something else

think about the bed, sideways sleepers are limited by the width of the van ( and require a climb over to use the can)
motorized sofas can be a tetris of cushions and the weight and complication of the motor device and the lack of storage under, could be a concern

cabinetry floor to ceiling/ over hanging can be claustrophobic

see as many models as you can

read up on the "van" part of the vehicle for reliability and do parts come from Germany or Italy? dealer service only? do dealers have lifts or bays with clearance for an RV or are you going to the "truck dept"


balancing energy use is crucial whether propane, AC or DC power- I'd stay away from newer unproven technologies
I read about some of that stuff and shake my head


simple and known systems can be serviced anywhere

research the dealer ( if using one) are warranties being resolved in an acceptable manner
( neighbor with new RV has had multiple warranty issues- each taking months at dealer - no use of RV)


Cheers, Mike

Yep, all of the above...my 2004 Pleasureway is VERY comfy, easy to repair...