Is a Suburban heater really a bad idea for low use?

[Detroit80]

Going through the rebuild on my van, and in that deciding what to keep or replace stage. I keep seeing references to the Suburban heaters being garbage, and to replace them with something like the Webasto units.

Is it just an efficiency or convience thing? Or is there some safety issue I'm not aware of?

I live and play largely in the southwest desert. I can't even remember the last time I turned on the heater in the house, and you couldn't pay me to go camping in sub freezing weather. I've often joked that I turn in to a whiny little girl real fast if the temp drops below 65F, and I'm in physical pain in anything below about 45F. I won't intentionally go camping somewhere that I know will be cold like that as I won't leave the heated camper anyways.

That said, I was planning on reinstalling the Suburban heater as a just in case thing...like say I take a trip through the mountains, and get stuck somewhere unplanned. But I'll probably never fire up this heater outside of occasionally testing it.

[booster]

Originally Posted by Detroit80

Going through the rebuild on my van, and in that deciding what to keep or replace stage. I keep seeing references to the Suburban heaters being garbage, and to replace them with something like the Webasto units.

Is it just an efficiency or convience thing? Or is there some safety issue I'm not aware of?

I live and play largely in the southwest desert. I can't even remember the last time I turned on the heater in the house, and you couldn't pay me to go camping in sub freezing weather. I've often joked that I turn in to a whiny little girl real fast if the temp drops below 65F, and I'm in physical pain in anything below about 45F. I won't intentionally go camping somewhere that I know will be cold like that as I won't leave the heated camper anyways.

That said, I was planning on reinstalling the Suburban heater as a just in case thing...like say I take a trip through the mountains, and get stuck somewhere unplanned. But I'll probably never fire up this heater outside of occasionally testing it.

I think the Webasto etc fever is a bit overblown. Yep, they are nice but also more upkep over time, IMO.



We have had a Suburban for 15 years and see no reason to change, it is quick to react to temp swings and warmup quiet enough for us and requires no special attention at all.


In a new van where it could combine hot water, heat, and tank heating I might consider it, but I doubt I could justify the cost and upkeep.

[Detroit80]

The cost is a big part of it for me. $1500, is a large chunk of coin for something that I intend to have little to no use on. But it's also not a cost that would bankrupt me if there was a compelling reason to switch it over either. About the only real compelling thing for me would be the ability to hook it to the van's gas tanks, and have a MUCH larger supply of heater fuel if the need ever arose, but I doubt I'd have enough supplies on board of other needed things to make it through weeks of being stuck somewhere anyways.

[GallenH]

Also based in AZ. For the most part we don't use our Suburban which still works well even though it was original to our 1997 PleasureWay. That said, we've camped along the Colorado river in fall and spring where the temps do drop to the low 40s. Also took a March trip to Utah where it got down to the low 30s. Similarly spent fall time in Minnesota where night temps were 30s-40s. Nice to have a thermostat set at 60 when you go to bed and remain comfortable during the night. I'd never remove ours unless it failed.

[The Eyesore]

I just replaced my 25-year-old Suburban NT-12 (no longer manufactured OR supported with parts) with the newer NT-16SE which supersedes it and is a direct, bolt-in replacement. The reason was that the blower motor had a worn out bronze bearing and was making an awful noise and spinning very slowly. Kind of a dangerous situation, actually. Anyways, $550 later, and I have a working heater. I also feel like I'll never use it, but I'm also a big ***** when it comes to the cold. I'd rather die from the sun than from the snow.

If yours is an older model and you have it out anyway, you might want to put a few drops of oil on the bearing where it meets the armature and check for excessive play.

Before I pulled the trigger on a new heater, I ever tried ordering a bronze bearing from a manufacturer that had a $50 minimum order with $25 shipping. The bearing was not a perfect fit and a complete waste of time and money.

The new heater unit was assembled poorly from the factory, in my opinion. I had to tighten up a gas pipe and a very loose ground junction.

Glad all that is behind me now.

[hbn7hj]

In your case the smarter move would be to keep the Suburban. The Webasto is a whole lot more effort to keep running properly. Turn the Suburban on and it will run.

The Webasto is quieter, uses vehicle fuel, has variable output rather than on and off but doesn’t work at altitude. Arizona has a lot of opportunity for altitude. You would be happier with the Suburban.

[Doneworking]

I have never had anything but a Suburban in my Class Bs and Cs over a forty year run with small motorhomes/vans. We boondock every summer in high altitude and need to run it in the mornings to take off the chill. Otherwise, I'm like Detroit80. We don't enjoy going someplace cold in the winter.

Other than just keeping it clean and checking it out for routine maintenance no problems in all those years. Don't waste money on something you won't use because there are lots of other things that can/will need money spent on them over time.

[Detroit80]

Originally Posted by hbn7hj

The Webasto is quieter, uses vehicle fuel, has variable output rather than on and off but doesn’t work at altitude. Arizona has a lot of opportunity for altitude. You would be happier with the Suburban.

Ahh yes, the altitude issue...another big one. Never really think much of it until dealing with stuff like this. I spend considerable amounts of time above 4,000 feet, and it would be a real bummer to find myself in some place like Flagstaff during an unexpected cold snap only to find a heater that doesn't want to fire, lol.

Pulling fuel from the van's 50 gallons of on board fuel tanks would be nice, but unless I could do the same for the refer and stove as well and eliminate the LP tank altogether, I see that as a limited benefit. If I find it's time to fire up the heater, that also means it's time to go to a warmer environment, so fuel use will be low anyways, lol.

Thanks for the advice, all 👍

[JohnnyFry]

My Surburban furnace works fine when I need it… sure, it is noisy and a system with underfloor heat with circulating glycol would be wonderful, but am I going to do it? On course not! although I have considered it and did some preliminary engineering work up.

[Detroit80]

I suspect underfloor heating would cost enough to immediately triple or quadruple the value of the van...sounds like the kind of thing that would be quoted in thousands...

[avanti]

Originally Posted by Detroit80

I suspect underfloor heating would cost enough to immediately triple or quadruple the value of the van...sounds like the kind of thing that would be quoted in thousands...

If you already have a hydronic heating system, adding underfloor radiant heat isn't too bad. Rixen's setup offers this as an option, and their controller can handle a second glycol loop (with its own circulation pump). In our new van, we used this feature to implement an under-van plumbing anti-freeze system for winter use.

An underfloor system would be nice for keeping your toes warm in the morning. However, I don't think I would want it as my primary heat source. Forced air can make a van comfortable in just a few minutes. Underfloor radiant can be kind of pokey. It would be ok if you keep the heat at an even set point for long periods, but we typically turn it down if we are going to be out for awhile, and want to quickly reheat when we return.

[Detroit80]

Originally Posted by avanti

If you already have a hydronic heating system,

I suppose I should qualify this a bit... I'm working with a 1987 Ford that wasn't exactly a high end coach when it was brand new. I have a planned budget of USD$10K, with a tightly crossed fingers hope of coming in under $5K, all in. From a materials cost standpoint, reusing as much as I can between what came out of this van and my equally old Lance truck camper, and valuing my labor time at zero, I'm on track to hit that 5K number.

I identify well with the other guy with the thread titled "Putting lipstick on a pig"

But this isn't going to be a full timer van, or even a regular use van. At least not from the RV standpoint. I figure I'll use it as a camper _maybe_ a dozen times a year, but with the advantage of still being to use it as a backup daily driver, or being able to occasionally drive it to work so it's not sitting unused for long periods of time.

[GeorgeRa]

I had two liquid fuel powered furnaces, a gas powered on our 1985 VW Westfalia and diesel powered one on our current Sprinter. The first one was a disaster, the current one is not trouble free. On previous RVs I had LPG powered furnaces, all loud but simple vs liquid fuel one quiet and finicky. Liquid fuel flow to gas and diesel furnaces needs to be extremely well control, bubbles are deadly. Deviations from stoichiometric ratio will make combustions unstable and very dirty. Combustion chambers must be clean regularly especially with diesel which requires disassembly or high heat runs on kerosene.

If I would face another conversion decision would:

1. Unquestionably go with LPG, liquid fuel heaters are too finicky. I posted my recent Eberspacher Airtronics issue on the Sprinter forum and one fellow called the design Eberspacher temperature control unit an Ad Hoc engineering, I agreed.

2. Review NA made LPG heaters like Atwood/Dometic or Suburban, there could be some improvements

3. Check Propex furnace (and water heater) https://www.propexheatsource.com/

4. Check Truma Combi https://truma.net/heating-systems/truma-combi-eco

[otr]

We have a Suburban furnace in our 2000 RT 190 V, it seems to work great, though we have never turned it on except to test it.
Just a reality check, when the double bed is set up, the furnace is under the center of it. Is it safe to operate it if there is nothing under the bed?