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03-07-2018, 02:31 PM
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#1
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Platinum Member
Join Date: May 2016
Location: East
Posts: 2,483
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Hymer and WATT Fuel Cell
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Erwin Hymer Group of North America and WATT Fuel Cell Sign Supply and Engineering Cooperation Agreement.
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...300609304.html
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03-07-2018, 03:58 PM
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#2
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Chaska MN
Posts: 1,763
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I'm a tad confused... would this replace the underhood generator to charge the battery? ...using propane? RTs would need bigger propane tanks then.
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2021 Promaster 1500 118wb conversion
2019 Roadtrek Simplicity SRT (almost a Zion)
2015 Roadtrek 170
2011 LTV Libero
2004 GWV Classic Supreme
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03-07-2018, 04:00 PM
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#3
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Platinum Member
Join Date: May 2016
Location: East
Posts: 2,483
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03-07-2018, 04:21 PM
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#4
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 130
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500W of continuous power at 0.34 lb/hr? The conversion rate isn't bad, but that's hardly going to power an AC unit. You'll need three of those units and then we are talking 1lb/hr. So as someone else mentioned, they are going to need a bigger tank
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03-07-2018, 04:42 PM
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#5
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Herndon, Virginia
Posts: 506
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You need to put it into the context of the Fuel cell running 24/7. At a 0.5kW capacity it should provide 12 kWH/day. Normally an A/C unit would not run continuously but the FC would continue to charge the battery. To really get an handle on things you would have to put a kWH meter on the A/C unit to see how much energy it actually uses over a 24 hour period. You would still need a battery as a storage device to even out the load over a 24 hour period.
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03-07-2018, 04:54 PM
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#6
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 12,389
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Looks like about 2 hours of running and .75# of propane to get 70ah, which would be about 1 days worth for many with compressor frigs of the 5ish cf size or smaller. I think a 30# tank like most of us have has about 24 usable, do you would be good for month of power if you didn't need the propane for anything else. Not all that bad, I guess, but I would be in line to get one if it ran on gasoline.
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03-07-2018, 05:56 PM
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#7
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Colorado
Posts: 106
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I just found this write-up of a fuel cell install in a truck camper...
https://www.truckcampermagazine.com/...truck-campers/
I agree that gasoline or diesel would be more interesting
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03-07-2018, 06:48 PM
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#8
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 978
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My question is, how much is this going to cost? Truma tried propane fuel cells with their VeGA line, and quietly killed them after a few years.
If they are reasonable (less than the price of the EFOY cells), this would be a technology that kills propane fridges dead.
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03-07-2018, 07:26 PM
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#9
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Arizona, Tempe
Posts: 1,697
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I'm not confused. Where do I send my money?
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03-07-2018, 07:54 PM
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#10
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Colorado
Posts: 106
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Looks like Efoy has US dealers in SC and on the west coast. This looks like the answer to the 24/7 small generator suggestion in the other thread. With a decent lithium battery bank to handle surges, this would be pricey but awesome.
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03-07-2018, 08:33 PM
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#11
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Colorado
Posts: 106
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Hmm, the Efoy comfort series has a max altitude of 2000m, not so useful everywhere I go...I wonder if they all have a relatively low limit?
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03-07-2018, 09:01 PM
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#12
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 12,389
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfturner
Hmm, the Efoy comfort series has a max altitude of 2000m, not so useful everywhere I go...I wonder if they all have a relatively low limit?
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I think the Efoy uses methanol, so that might have something to do with it because of the low pressure at altitude and the vapor pressure of methanol. Of course it could also be an air fuel ratio thing that all would have.
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03-07-2018, 09:13 PM
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#13
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Arizona, Tempe
Posts: 1,697
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EFOY fuel is too expensive and unobtanium. I don't believe the propane fuel cell is real but when/if it is it solves the fuel problem.
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03-08-2018, 05:22 PM
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#14
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: WA
Posts: 194
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Constantly stopping to find more propane is not my idea of good time. Diesel and gas do a much better job of generating power to run AC and other appliances.
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User formerly known as Transit
2017 Trend 23L
2011 13' Scamp
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03-08-2018, 09:56 PM
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#15
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Arizona, Tempe
Posts: 1,697
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A 500 watt fuel cell is not intended to run A/C or a microwave. It is intended to keep the batteries charged with the increased power draw of compressor fridges and entertainment centers.
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03-08-2018, 10:00 PM
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#16
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Platinum Member
Join Date: May 2016
Location: East
Posts: 2,483
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Quote:
500W of continuous power at 0.34 lb/hr?
The conversion rate isn't bad, but that's hardly going to power an AC unit. You'll need three of those units and then we are talking 1lb/hr. So as someone else mentioned, they are going to need a bigger tank
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What is the thermal conversion efficiency?
Someone got a calculator?
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03-09-2018, 01:54 AM
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#17
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Colorado
Posts: 106
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Someone please check my math, I'm only getting 23%
.34 #/hr is 155g/hr
155 g * 2200 KJ/mol / 44 g/mol = 7735 KJ potential
500 watts.hr * 3.6 KJ/w.hr = 1800 KJ converted
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03-09-2018, 04:43 AM
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#18
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Colorado
Posts: 106
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Fwiw, I found a site claiming a 3.6 kw Onan consumes 0.7 gal/hr of propane, by similar math that works out to 18% which is in the ballpark of what I expected. I'll see if I can find a claim of methanol usage of the Efoy. My math still need double checking..
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03-09-2018, 04:58 AM
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#19
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Colorado
Posts: 106
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Hmm, similar math for the methanol in an Efoy gives 22.5%
8.4 kg at 21 Mj/kg vs 920 ah at 12v at 3.6 kj/wh
[Edit] elsewhere the Efoy claims 0.9 l per kwh, which is about 25%, so that's the range, a bit better than the Onan, but temperature sensitive including for storage. There is no fee lunch I guess.
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03-09-2018, 02:37 PM
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#20
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Platinum Member
Join Date: May 2016
Location: East
Posts: 2,483
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.
IIRC... that's a better ratio than converting electricity to light,
or converting gasoline to horsepower.
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