Does anyone have some experience with new 12 Volt DC AC

[Davydd]

Originally Posted by avanti

BTW: is it as quiet as everybody says?

Yes. I have heard several demonstrations including one in a Promaster chassis at last year's B-Rally and a few in ARVs. They have a video demonstrating the difference but hearing the actual is believing.

[gregmchugh]

Originally Posted by avanti

BTW: is it as quiet as everybody says?

Much quieter than the Coleman Mach 8 it replaced...

[gregmchugh]

Originally Posted by avanti

Does anybody know how ARV dealt with the 240VAC->120VAC issue with the Houghton? Did they get them to build a 120VAC version? Or, are they using some kind of voltage converter?

It is a 120v version

[Phoebe3]

Originally Posted by AAFD

Coachmen and Advanced RV are both using 12 volt DC AC in they're rigs. I was looking for some feed back on how well they worked.

I hang out in the Crossfit FB group. At this time, only a couple of members have the 12V ProAir units and they haven't had them during the summer (the 12V AC units are a new offering) so there haven't been any real-world reports detailing performance yet.

I believe they are going to become standard on the Galleria and are provided as an option for special builds of the Crossfit/Beyond. Current option price on a Crossfit/Beyond is about $3,600.

[Flatlander1]

I have a 2019 Coachmen Galleria with the Pro Air 12V 20,000 BTU Air Conditioner. I am very happy with it. Going across Louisiana couple days ago, I started at 14.1v AGM house battery, after 9 hours driving battery was 13.3v. Also running 12v refrig. Outside air temp 77-80. No generator running at all but does have 300w solar. Teenagers happy in back and cool. Going down the highway it's very quiet. In front of my house(or campground) it has a different tone but for sure no worse than a Dometic, just different. Everyone is curious how long a full battery will last while boondocking with AGM or Lithium package. I haven't done and I don't know. 12v a/c and refrig and Truma heat/hot water are a must nowadays!! All JMHO.

[AAFD]

Originally Posted by Flatlander1

I have a 2019 Coachmen Galleria with the Pro Air 12V 20,000 BTU Air Conditioner. I am very happy with it. Going across Louisiana couple days ago, I started at 14.1v AGM house battery, after 9 hours driving battery was 13.3v. Also running 12v refrig. Outside air temp 77-80. No generator running at all but does have 300w solar. Teenagers happy in back and cool. Going down the highway it's very quiet. In front of my house(or campground) it has a different tone but for sure no worse than a Dometic, just different. Everyone is curious how long a full battery will last while boondocking with AGM or Lithium package. I haven't done and I don't know. 12v a/c and refrig and Truma heat/hot water are a must nowadays!! All JMHO.

Thank you, if you come up with answers please post

KC

[chris_g19]

DC will never be as good as AC for air conditioning. The efficiency of an inverter is better than the reduced efficiency of a DC compressor. AC compressor motors are great, why change it?

They just do this for marketing to get people excited about not needing an inverter for air conditioning.

[avanti]

Originally Posted by chris_g19

DC will never be as good as AC for air conditioning. The efficiency of an inverter is better than the reduced efficiency of a DC compressor. AC compressor motors are great, why change it?

They just do this for marketing to get people excited about not needing an inverter for air conditioning.

Well, modern DC compressors (such as the beloved Danfoss) have external controllers that convert DC power to multi-phase AC that is fed to sealed synchronous motors. This is done to avoid having brushes (which generate dirt and wear out) sealed inside the compressor. If you start with AC, it is first converted to DC, as needed by said controller.

I suspect that the efficiency of these controllers is on par with the efficiency of an inverter. Indeed, it is probably higher, since it is tuned precisely for the needed load.

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by avanti

…………………………..
I suspect that the efficiency of these controllers is on par with the efficiency of an inverter. Indeed, it is probably higher, since it is tuned precisely for the needed load.
I suspect that the efficiency of these controllers is on par with the efficiency of an inverter. Indeed, it is probably higher, since it is tuned precisely for the needed load.

Efficiency of Inverter AC is higher indeed. “The biggest difference between inverter and non-inverter AC is the fact that the motor of the inverter compressor has a variable speed. ... A censor in the invertor adjusts the power according to the temperature in the room, lowering the electrical consumption and saving energy.Apr 22, 2016”

https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C...30.GbkL7TixHOo

After replacing the capillary temperature probe thermostat (on or off only) on my Danfoss fridge to the electronic thermostat efficiency went up and noise went down.

[B-RV]

A dealer that sells Advance, and Coachmen did a test on noise levels, he also stated the 12 volt A/C runs an extra 2 hours on Lithium then the standard dometic A/C....
Coachmen Crossfit came in quieter than the $250K + Advance RV

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by B-RV

A dealer that sells Advance, and Coachmen did a test on noise levels, he also stated the 12 volt A/C runs an extra 2 hours on Lithium then the standard dometic A/C....
Coachmen Crossfit came in quieter than the $250K + Advance RV

I didn’t find any info if these units have variable speed compressors. If I read it correctly, they can use engine coolant for heating, adding a hydronic furnace will take care all heating needs not just while driving.

The noise difference between these units is dramatic.

[Davydd]

Originally Posted by B-RV

A dealer that sells Advance, and Coachmen did a test on noise levels, he also stated the 12 volt A/C runs an extra 2 hours on Lithium then the standard dometic A/C....
Coachmen Crossfit came in quieter than the $250K + Advance RV

Dealers will say anything. What dealer sells Advanced RV? Advanced RV sells direct to owners and takes trade ins on their own builds. In fact, there has only been one Advanced RV out in the wild for a dealer to get ahold of (I asked) and it wasn't one with their new Houghton air conditioner. I think the dealer was blowing smoke up your A--.

If you are comparing the Coachmen 12V air conditioner to a Dometic Mach 8 it will be quieter in all reports.

[B-RV]

Originally Posted by Davydd

Dealers will say anything. What dealer sells Advanced RV? Advanced RV sells direct to owners and takes trade ins on their own builds. In fact, there has only been one Advanced RV out in the wild for a dealer to get ahold of (I asked) and it wasn't one with their new Houghton air conditioner. I think the dealer was blowing smoke up your A--.

If you are comparing the Coachmen 12V air conditioner to a Dometic Mach 8 it will be quieter in all reports.

When in doubt, do it yourself, please share your results with us. I have the Li3 with the 20K BTU A/C, quietest A/C i've ever experienced, it even beat out my beloved Newmar!

[Davydd]

Read back. The Advanced RV Houghton air conditioner has already been covered in this thread and one member, Greg McHugh, had Advanced RV install one in his RV that originally had a Dometic Mach 8. Also, I said I heard several demonstrations in Sprinter RVs and one Promaster RV to verify the claim that it was 3 times quieter, IMO, as stated in this video. Greg can expound on it better than me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2zQkBDPOLW4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qs9RdgivzRI

[gregmchugh]

Well, that is a Houghton in the picture showing the 3 sound level readings.

I can confirm that the Houghton is much quieter than the Coleman Mach 8 it replaced. At some point the sound level reading is lower but practically not relevant to me, we can easily talk and sleep with the sound level of the Houghton, if it was quieter I guess that would be nice but not very significant in actual usage for us.

Our RV is so well insulated that a High BTU AC does not run the compressor enough to reduce the humidity, the Coleman had this issue. The Houghton has a mode to reduce humidity but I have not tried it yet to see how well it works. We used the regular cooling mode in Florida but the temps were not real high and the humidity was not high (December) so not a good test but we like it so far and avoid high humidity hot areas so not very concerned about that case.

For our RV a lower BTU DC split unit might be ideal, with the extreme insulation we have it would probably get lower power usage and longer runs on battery but still provide enough cooling. A 20k BTU Pro Air would probably not run the compressor enough to reduce the humidity in our case.

[Binny]

Originally Posted by gregmchugh

Well, that is a Houghton in the picture showing the 3 sound level readings.

I can confirm that the Houghton is much quieter than the Coleman Mach 8 it replaced. At some point the sound level reading is lower but practically not relevant to me, we can easily talk and sleep with the sound level of the Houghton, if it was quieter I guess that would be nice but not very significant in actual usage for us.

Our RV is so well insulated that a High BTU AC does not run the compressor enough to reduce the humidity, the Coleman had this issue. The Houghton has a mode to reduce humidity but I have not tried it yet to see how well it works. We used the regular cooling mode in Florida but the temps were not real high and the humidity was not high (December) so not a good test but we like it so far and avoid high humidity hot areas so not very concerned about that case.

For our RV a lower BTU DC split unit might be ideal, with the extreme insulation we have it would probably get lower power usage and longer runs on battery but still provide enough cooling. A 20k BTU Pro Air would probably not run the compressor enough to reduce the humidity in our case.

I'm heartened that there is some innovating going on for these applications.