Deciding on which class B to buy.

[Rok]

Since our Great West Legend SE is arriving soon, we're shopping for insurance. I started a new thread about that topic. http://www.classbforum.com/phpBB2/vi...php?f=9&t=2513

Teachergal: Don't you insure with Good Sam's Club? Do they treat your right? (Maybe you just get their roadside assistance insurance.)

Thanks again to everyone for posting!

.............Rocky

[peteco]

Originally Posted by Rok

So he bought us a super fancy split screen half mirror, half monitor that turns into a full mirror if you turn the monitor off. He says it's slick and we should be happy with it.
..........Rocky

Can you please post the information for this unit? I need to install a backup camera.

Thanks,
Pete
2006 RT210P

[Rok]

Hey Pete,

I don't have the link regarding the mirror at hand. I'll try to get it for you. Dave of GW sent me a link, but I looked at it and have forgotten it. Sorry.

I tried to Google it up and came up with tons of things that aren't like what we are getting--and nothing like it.

Also, when talking about this stuff, it is important to dinstinguish between a "backup camera & monitor" and a "rear view camera & monitor". One only comes on when your car/van is in reverse, the other is also on when your drive forward. The new rigs, ERA, Interstate, Plateau, etc. seem to be going with rear view cameras that are on all the time.

............Rocky

[Rok]

Hi Pete,

Here is a YouTube video of something like what we are getting. I hope it is not the same one because if you read the comments to the video, some people think the image is not real in the video. Maybe the product is O.K., but why would they have to dummy up the YouTube video with fake graphics. It is a flag to not buy the item, but sometimes, taking a video of something doesn't do the product justice. At least, here is a video for you to look at.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xq2z_-D44gI

Here is a video from the same company I believe supplies the rear view monitors for the Plateau, Interstate, and ERA class B's. I'm not sure if it is the same company, and I'm sure it is not the same product, but the mounting is the same, and I "think" it is the same company.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YezOZc-LAgM

I think the following might be the one they are using in the above listed vehicles. For the price, it is a cheap add-on that is really cool for a Sprinter based Class B.

http://www.chinavasion.com/china/wholes ... or_Monitor

Actually that company seems to have a lot of different options:

http://www.chinavasion.com/

............Rocky

[pattonsr]

Great West put out a newsletter in which they said they are designing a new model. I wonder what they have in mind.

[casd]

Hello,

Very interesting posts here, I am in the market for a 20 ft Class B, I was all set on the Roadtrek CS but too much money and parking is my main concern, I am very handy, Have solar at my house, inverter with some battery backup etc. I was ready to purchase a used class B until visiting a dealer and didn't realize they changed from 5 Cylinder Diesel to 6 in 2010 - mid

I want to haul the 5000 lb's or close to it sometimes, I realize the 3500 chassis would be best but don't want the extra length, With the new Winnebago Travato on the way, could be a game changer in resale value, but only in gas at first

I would like to know plus and minus to 5 cylinder diesel verses 6 cylinder, I have chosen looking for a Roadtrek Agile but after reading posts here open to others

Thanks for any help
Chuck
CA

[mlts22]

Originally Posted by casd

Hello,

Very interesting posts here, I am in the market for a 20 ft Class B, I was all set on the Roadtrek CS but too much money and parking is my main concern, I am very handy, Have solar at my house, inverter with some battery backup etc. I was ready to purchase a used class B until visiting a dealer and didn't realize they changed from 5 Cylinder Diesel to 6 in 2010 - mid

I want to haul the 5000 lb's or close to it sometimes, I realize the 3500 chassis would be best but don't want the extra length, With the new Winnebago Travato on the way, could be a game changer in resale value, but only in gas at first

I would like to know plus and minus to 5 cylinder diesel verses 6 cylinder, I have chosen looking for a Roadtrek Agile but after reading posts here open to others

Thanks for any help
Chuck
CA

The 5 cylinder diesel on the T1N isn't made anymore, so if you want a 20 foot "B", it will be a NCV3 six.

One thing I might throw in here. Dodge is going to be selling a 20-21 foot van which is a rebadged Fiat Ducato. I don't know how much it may tow, but it might just be something to wait for. Winnebago will be putting out one of the first upfits. If you don't mind waiting about 18 months, the Ford Transit will be out and I'm sure there will be plenty of places offering upfits on that chassis.

Things are going to get real interesting in the class B market in the next 1-2 years. Right now, the Sprinter is the only game in town, but it will have some heavy competition breathing down its neck.

[Rok]

Hi Chuck,

20 ft is pretty short. Most of the Sprinters are 22' 9", and a few are extended to 24' 1". As you mentioned, the RoadTrek Agile is 19' 6". Pleasure Way has brought back their Ascent recently this year, which is also built on the 19' 6" 2500 Sprinter. In order to get one of those, you would have to be willing to pony up the cash to buy new. (Although I did see a 2007 Ascent on RV Trader.com.

Whatever you do, please make sure you go to a dealer and spend some time in one of the short ones. They are pretty cramped. the 3' of extra length is an amazing addition. Even the 1'4" extra for the extended versions is a lot of space when you go inside.

The 5 cilinder units had significantly better gas mileage because of less epa stuff (at least that is what I've been told).

Good luck in your search.

............Rocky

[markopolo]

Originally Posted by casd

............I want to haul the 5000 lb's or close to it sometimes, I realize the 3500 chassis would be best but don't want the extra length......

Re: towing - Mike shared this link with me a while back Travel Trailer Weight Calculator It is useful for figuring out what you can tow (it doesn't have to be a travel trailer). One item to note is the safety margin. The calculator suggests 20%. You might need a van that can tow closer to 6000 lbs if you actually want to tow 5000 lbs.

[casd]

Originally Posted by mlts22

Thanks for reply
I agree totally with the market is going to change, Checked out the Ram on the Winnebago site, Gas engine first, could be good or bad, I am looking at a 2008 Pleasure Way Ascent at a good value, might be a better way to go until we see what happens, All this could affect the value of the resale market

[casd]

Originally Posted by Rok

Hi Chuck,

20 ft is pretty short. Most of the Sprinters are 22' 9", and a few are extended to 24' 1". As you mentioned, the RoadTrek Agile is 19' 6". Pleasure Way has brought back their Ascent recently this year, which is also built on the 19' 6" 2500 Sprinter. In order to get one of those, you would have to be willing to pony up the cash to buy new. (Although I did see a 2007 Ascent on RV Trader.com.

Whatever you do, please make sure you go to a dealer and spend some time in one of the short ones. They are pretty cramped. the 3' of extra length is an amazing addition. Even the 1'4" extra for the extended versions is a lot of space when you go inside.

The 5 cilinder units had significantly better gas mileage because of less epa stuff (at least that is what I've been told).

Good luck in your search.

............Rocky

Thanks for reply Rocky, You bring up some valuable points , Initially when you enter a 20 foot model then go to a 22 foot big difference, Is Roadtrek actually 22.9 or 22 feet ? I have heard the same on 5 cylinder , better gas mileage

[casd]

Originally Posted by markopolo

Re: towing - Mike shared this link with me a while back Travel Trailer Weight Calculator It is useful for figuring out what you can tow (it doesn't have to be a travel trailer). One item to note is the safety margin. The calculator suggests 20%. You might need a van that can tow closer to 6000 lbs if you actually want to tow 5000 lbs.

I will check the Calculator out, This is a concern as you mentioned, then the weight of a trailer that can carry a good load is heavy itself , might make the choice to Roadtrek 22 foot with 7000 lb towing and enjoy inside benefits of longer length but put up with the parking hassle

[markopolo]

You most probably won't have 7,000 lbs towing capacity. You have to subtract the following:

(4) Maximum towable weight with driver only. This weight reduced by weight of optional equipment, fuel, water, propane, cargo and/or passengers.

That's from their site. It was left off the current specs but still applies.

also subtract the weight of clothing, gear, food etc. ......................

[Rok]

I think all the regular Sprinters (Roadtrek calls one of their models "RS" for Regular Sprinter, IIRC) are 22' 9", but I actually haven't measured one myself--that would be too difficult, so I just take the Mfg's and outfitter's words for it.

I know that sometimes the outfitters can make them a little longer by putting some accessory on one end or the other, but I don't think they can make them any shorter.

I do know that the 1' 4" extra that you get in an extended version is a lot more than it sounds like. It equates to somewhere around 65 sq. ft of additonal space, so if redistributed you could get that much more storage in an extended van. The difference between a Short Sprinter B & a Regular Sprinter B is even larger so there has to be a lot of concessions made to squeeze everything in.

..........Rocky

Originally Posted by casd

Thanks for reply Rocky, You bring up some valuable points , Initially when you enter a 20 foot model then go to a 22 foot big difference, Is Roadtrek actually 22.9 or 22 feet ? I have heard the same on 5 cylinder , better gas mileage

[casd]

Originally Posted by markopolo

You most probably won't have 7,000 lbs towing capacity. You have to subtract the following:

That's from their site. It was left off the current specs but still applies.

also subtract the weight of clothing, gear, food etc. ......................

Thanks for the info - Roadtrek lists 7000 lbs towing earlier years were 7500 for diesel , They also list 3000 lbs carrying capacity, I tried the weight calculator posted earlier, have to find some additional information to use the calculator , I think there is a simpler formula , Guess if you were one person that added up to 2000 lbs for all the water gas etc, you subtract from 7000 and have 5000, if there was only 5000 to start with that is 3000, that doesn't leave much, Where was tongue weight come into play ?

[Davydd]

The earlier model regular Sprinters were 21'-11" not including any back mounted spare tire or step bumpers. The newer regular Sprinters are 22'-9" without step bumpers or spare tire. There, of course, are shorter Sprinters, and with the newer version an extended Sprinter of 24'-1'. Rocky, I think you meant to say 65 cubic feet more for the extended Sprinter. Square feet would equate to about 8 square foot more. How that extra space is utilized varies. Winnebago extends the floor plan to the back door so the apparent additional space is not easily quantified though there. Great West Vans and Advanced RV have utilized that space for standup items stored inside like bikes by leaving the sofa/bed in the same relative position with the plan thus creating a gap.

[Rok]

Yes, Davydd, I meant Cubic Feet, not square feet.

[markopolo]

Originally Posted by casd

Thanks for the info - Roadtrek lists 7000 lbs towing earlier years were 7500 for diesel , They also list 3000 lbs carrying capacity, I tried the weight calculator posted earlier, have to find some additional information to use the calculator , I think there is a simpler formula , Guess if you were one person that added up to 2000 lbs for all the water gas etc, you subtract from 7000 and have 5000, if there was only 5000 to start with that is 3000, that doesn't leave much, Where was tongue weight come into play ?

If the specs list 7000 lbs towing unloaded, before options etc. then you might have close to 5000 lbs actual towing capacity. It should be more than 3000 lbs. but your quick calculation looks to be very safe. I think my GM van can safely tow around 3,600 lbs. The basic cargo van brochure for my particular 1997 van shows towing capacity at 6,000 lbs and allowed for driver and passenger only, no equipment or cargo etc. Other 1997 G3500 vans in the same GM brochure ( all 1 tons) had max trailer weight specs ranging from 5,000 to 10,000 lbs depending on the various combinations of engines and axle ratios. My point in mentioning that is that you can't rely on the generic specs posted on a Class B manufacturers site if towing 5000 lbs or is important to you. You really need the specs for the particular van you are interested in. B van manufacturers reserve the right to adjust specs as needed based on many reasons - one being the supply of vans.

I don't think that I know that much about towing - only the basics - so anyone please jump in here and correct me. My understanding of tongue weight is that it is one of many factors that limit max tow weight. If you keep within the suggested 10% - 15% tongue weight then you are limited to trailers that weigh 3,333 to 5,000 lbs is using a typical Class III hitch. 5,000 lbs would be really maxing a Class III hitch out. And, other factors might further limit the maximum trailer weight.

That's why I think filling in all the blanks on a calculator like this: http://changingears.com/rv-sec-calc-tra ... t-tt.shtml is so helpful. The result from the calculator will be based on the "weakest link" in your setup.

[casd]

Thanks for all the info here, I will use the calculator when I decide what to purchase but this clearly shows you need the highest rating possible , most roadtrek Dual Wheel Sprinters are about 7000 lbs, have 2000 lbs in the vehicle that is 5000 lbs , allow 1000 lbs to 2000 lbs for the trailer, you can be as low as 3000 lbs capacity , I wouldn't be using this all the time and I would want to stay under the limit , if you're thinking of a small car maybe better just the car with stuff inside,

[casd]

after much research and frustration trying to find a good used Class B Diesel at a reasonable price I have decided to purchase a good used sprinter and have it partially done by Sportsmobile in Fresno Ca, http://www.sportsmobile.com/ I haven't checked them out but prices seem reasonable. If I don't find a used I might go new - (Found a 2012 3500 144 inch with 5000 miles for 26k but when I called found out it was in a flood, not willing to risk that kind of money) Maybe the new 4 cylinder with 7 speed automatic being released this fall , Everybody will hate me but going with 3500 dual wheel 144 inch , I plan on as many solar panels as possible and lots of batteries , that's why 3500 for the weight, (Goal - Park in a parking space, not enough room hook the trailer on) Priorities will be insulated, heater, air conditioner bath shower, large refrigerator rear bed one side , lots of space for storage, maybe not even fixed stove, I will out do the ETrek for far less money and have something that works, I have read many articles, The ETrek don't seem to pencil out, not that I would spend that money anyway, Any feedback appreciated especially on 4 cylinder diesel Mercedes , I read one article said it didn't have enough power, I will take my time traveling, This is for retirement