Class B and HOAs

[Chanuk]

Have any of you had experienced difficulties from your HOA about parking your Class B motorhome in your driveway? If so how did you resolve it? Not interested in parking this van in a different location. Use it as a second vehicle. Any suggestions or thoughts appreciated. Thanks

[rowiebowie]

Originally Posted by Chanuk

Have any of you had experienced difficulties from your HOA about parking your Class B motorhome in your driveway? If so how did you resolve it? Not interested in parking this van in a different location. Use it as a second vehicle. Any suggestions or thoughts appreciated. Thanks

Welcome to the forum Chanuk!

HOA enforcement varies as much as anything I can think of, so your experience may not be mine.

Our HOA is very poorly run (sometimes a good thing) and usually it is a neighbor complaint that triggers a "violation" letter. In my case, I purchased the stealthiest class b I could find, removed the badging, and in two years it has been ok. If I was to get a letter I would fight it on medical conditions, but HOA's have been upheld in court cases to have broad powers in most states, so who knows what the outcome would be.

The wisdom of "asking for permission" versus "don't tell anyone and see how it goes" is also as varied as there are any other opinions. I understand your desire and I prefer the same ability to park it in my driveway, but if I ever moved, I'd seek a non-HOA neighborhood.

Do you have the ability to park beside your home behind the "building line" or front-most part of your house? That might keep you out of trouble. If I could do that (I can't), then I'd have no complaint from my HOA.

Good luck.

[SteveWolf]

Read the HOA rules. Talk up the board. Ask them.

The makeup of each association is different than any other. You can't say, "you will find". The passage of time will morph the association you have now into something completely different in a few years.

You might be fine for decades. If an association now or in the future decides that you are driving an RV and you are not an attorney it will cost you at least $6000.00 to litigate the meaning of RV. You might win if you are driving a nineteen foot Chevy Roadtrek. Maybe. If you are driving something that looks more like an RV, maybe not. The "I drive my Roadtrek to work every day" has no different meaning than "I drive my forty foot Winnebago to work every day".

A good place to start might be checking the case law for your state. Maybe you'll find some definitions that would help. Google Scholar is your friend.

I have no HOA at my home in Ohio and still have to battle attempts to change city zoning now and again. I am the HOA president for my OBX condo where I park my Roadtrek 190P. Getting involved in your HOA can keep the lid on things.

Steve

[FlyingDiver]

Originally Posted by Chanuk

Have any of you had experienced difficulties from your HOA about parking your Class B motorhome in your driveway? If so how did you resolve it? Not interested in parking this van in a different location. Use it as a second vehicle. Any suggestions or thoughts appreciated. Thanks

Pull out your HOA documents (CCR, etc) and see exactly what it says. If it explicitly restricts RVs or vehicles over a certain size, it doesn't matter what you're interested in doing, the HOA will prevail.

But you should also drive around the development on look for other RVs or large vehicles and see how long they are parked. Take photos. If someone else has been parking an RV and the HOA hasn't made them move it, and you can document that, then the HOA will have a hard time making you move yours. They can't do selective enforcement, and if they have not enforced in the past it's harder to do so now.

[papab]

Are you already there, or thinking about moving there?

Another thing you might try is getting the rules changed, or a variance to allow a small RV. Limited by less than xx long and xx tall.

[Chanuk]

Thank you for all of your thoughts. There has been another class B that has been parked in the owners driveway for over 6 years. He also received a notice recently. My issue I believe was triggered by a neighbor who delights in causing trouble. I have explored a number of options. According to the NC vehicle code a vehicle is defined as a “house car” ( camper) if it meets certain criteria. The first question they asked me is ; does the vehicle have a bathroom. If so it is classified as a house car. My current plan is to remove the bathroom ie the toilet. This I believe will remove it from being classed as a camper. My argument will become that it is no longer a camper under the state mv code but rather simply a conversion van and therefore not subject to the covenant. Keep you posted on how this goes

[mumkin]

Every HOA is different. Here is my HOA soap opera. I am one who always lives in a condo or townhouse where outside work is taken care of... and that means an HOA. I doubt that you will find an HOA that doesn't restrict RVs to some level. Many will accept "conversion vans." But then in Minnesota, the first two letters on your license plates say "RV." I ordered my last two rigs with no awning or lettering of any kind. When I bought my 170, I traded in both my Libero and a Sienna van. (they owed me money 'to boot') Of course it wouldn't fit in my underground condo building. Although it fit in a parking space outside, I saw that RV parking was to come up at the next board meeting. At the same time I was house hunting and found a small townhouse. The 170 fit nicely in the driveway... even though it was shared with a neighbor. Nothing was said for 2.5 summers (I winter in AZ). Then I traded in my big silver Chevy van for a big silver Promaster van. It is only 10 inches longer and 4 inches wider and still fits in the driveway. But the Promaster is taller and certainly more imposing. My neighbor came back from her summer at the lake... and bitched to the board. I got a letter saying that although they knew it was my only vehicle, I couldn't bring it back in the spring and park on the property. The management company pointed out that it had "RV plates." But, of course, I came back and put it in my driveway. I got another letter after I got back which offered to have a meeting about it. In the meantime, I ordered personalized plates, so it no longer said "RV." I got a letter from my doctor confirming my need to drive an RV... and photocopied the American for Disabilities Act the confirmed that my issue was included. I argued that they had first set a precedent by allowing me to park the 170 there for 2.5 years, it was no longer tagged as an RV, and I had a legitimate medical reason for using it as my daily driver. I never threatened, but it was clear that I would fight them under the ADA... and only rarely does one lose a case with ADA support. So, they caved... partially. I got a letter giving me permission to park on the property... in the guest parking. LOL

Considering that the whole reason for an HOA to ban RVs is to keep them from filling up the limited guest parking with boats, 4 wheels, and trailers, it seem rather ludicrous.

But I had purchased another place that looked as if it would be more casual even though their rules were more stringent. It says vehicles must be in the garage and no work vans. But it is less than a mile from a good storage facility if needed. After I moved in, I noticed that just across the parking lot from the HOA president is a resident with 3 vehicles... one of them a work van that sits there every night and all weekend. So, it appears that I won't have an issue. (I also removed my AC before moving in since I am fine with the fan... replaced it with a maxfan) So it arrived as a conversion van... and nothing was heard before I headed south.

Watch this space. (I warned you it was a soap opera)

[FlyingDiver]

Originally Posted by Chanuk

Thank you for all of your thoughts. There has been another class B that has been parked in the owners driveway for over 6 years. He also received a notice recently.

What is the exact wording in the HOA docs they are citing?

[mumkin]

Originally Posted by FlyingDiver

What is the exact wording in the HOA docs they are citing?

The exact wording often ends up moot as enforcement tends to be like his example. They allowed someone to park there for 6 years and suddenly it gets enforced.

As I said to my HOA, if I went down to the Promaster dealer and bought a van... that would look exactly the same... and be the same size... they could not say anything to me under existing bylaws. And my neighbors couldn't complain. That to me is the illogical part of rules like this. One of the board members has a Ram pickup that is the same size as my van, but not as tall. Now my new HOA does mention fitting in the garage that they may be able to push me on. But I still have the ADA on my side.

Like everything, HOAs have their pros and cons.

[Chanuk]

I can post the exact wording later today. I am on the road right now. Thanks For those of us raised in small towns HOAs are mostly negative.

[Davydd]

My view of HOAs has changed and mostly positive. I lived in a house for 34 years I designed and built that was on a 1-1/2 acre nearly old growth forest lot that backed up to a marsh that went on for at least a mile before intersected by a road. My neighbors’ houses were about 100 foot away on both sides and the house was 300 feet off the road and you couldn’t see it in the summer time from the road. It was kind of a private heaven but over the years aging got to me and it became a hell. The driveway had a 12% slope, the house was 5 open levels, and the aging forest was becoming unmanageable and expensive to maintain. Not a place for a retired person. Fortunately, I found a single-level development HOA with no exterior maintenance with more surrounding or more and closer amenities than I had before.

It was an HOA consisting of 8 twin homes (16 units) on a private cul-de-sac street. We owned the land but only 5 foot out from the foundation. The rest was common ownership including a large storm water retention pond. The HOA contracts out snowplowing the private street including the driveways, landscaping maintenance and grass mowing, trash collection, exterior maintenance of the buildings including annual gutter cleaning and raking leaves. Still the HOA dues were less than I spent annually for forest maintenance. There of course is a price to pay for this but I can leave on an RV trip with no qualms.



I was the first purchaser and wisely chose the home with south facing windows and and an extra separation from an easement to maintain the retention ponds by the city. I found it early on because there was a four mile paved hiking/biking trail in the park that was one of my routines about 5 miles from my old house. This development sold out in about a year. I thought I was going to downsize but this house has more finished space than my old house. It has a walk-out finished basement mostly for guest and family visits, and mostly my wife’s hobby rooms. There is no reason to go down there other than furnace utility room duties.

What I gained. The downtown, a former small rural farm town, has joined the suburbs. It is now a trendy center with 12 eating establishments, a library, city hall, and a craft brewery tap room all accessible on the regional 14 mile long biking trail that connects to all the regional trails throughout the Twin Cities (Minneapolis/St. Paul). Carver Park Reserve is a 3,700 acre park with 11 miles of paved trails and 25 miles of total trails including secluded forest walks, cross-country ski, horse, and snowshoeing. It has a nature center, a 50 RV campground and 10 lakes with four of them with boat launches. Down the road a miles drive is the entrance to the 1,200 acre University of Minnesota Landscape Arboretum, voted the best arboretum in the country with more trails. A quarter of a mile away is the University of Minnesota Horticulture Center where the honey crisp apple was developed and winter grapes to create a wine industry in the upper midwest. Now they have created a program for hops to boost the craft brewing industry.

So that’s my story and why I was pried out of my life’s achievement, a hand-cut mortise and tenon wood pegged home that I designed and built with my own hands that I dedicated over a year’s work sabbatical to build. It wasn’t easy to give up but probably necessary.

Now on to phase two. What to do with our RV going on 13 years. I knew going in that we couldn’t park at our home. Even though physically possible in our driveway, it was very inconvenient to have it there. Besides, the HOA rules said any vehicle had to be garageable. I knew I had to have off-site storage. I knew with lithium ion batteries I would have to have an electrical source. I found but one outside parking space meeting that criteria in the western suburbs of Minneapolis and rented it. That wasn’t satisfactory and it was a whopping 40 miles away. I stored outside at my old home but had access to the RV at all times. Then it dawned on me. Condo garages were big in the Twin Cities for classic car collectors. There was one just four miles away in Chanhassen that I knew about. It just seemed too fancy for me to consider and it was sold out.

AutoMotorPlex Chanhassen Garage Condos - AutoMotorPlex® Garage Condos

I wasn’t thinking. Condo garages are dear and they are an investment. I started investigating and found another one 9, almost non-stop, highway miles from my home. It was a 270 unit gated development.

https://www.parkplacestorage.net/minnetrista

As I said, it was an investment that the county tax accessor has confirmed in the two years I’ve owned it. An investment I hope for my heirs.



Again, an HOA sort of with lots of common amenities including a wash stall that can handle Class A RVs, a dump station, water, WiFI, and gated security. I not only can park my RV but it is for extra storage, a man cave and wood shop. I bought the smallest unit available at 45’ x 18’. The manager said it was the only unit available at the time. The previous owner put down that checkered flag epoxy floor. I guess it was a sign that beckoned me, a Speedway, Indiana native, to buy it.

[Janet H]

Mod hat on: Several posts have been removed from this thread.

Link to the site rules: https://www.classbforum.com/forums/m...ork&page=rules

Note the bits about ".. offensive comments about race, gender, sexual orientation, religion, and national origin, are not acceptable" as well as prohibitions on political wanderings. Please stick to the topic of the thread; HOAs and parking your rig.

[Rockwood27]

I'm currently facing the opposite issue with my Roadtrek 190P built on a Chevy Express van. I want to store it at my daughter's association's RV and boat storage lot. We own the home that my daughter lives in. I showed a photo of the RT to the HOA manager and she said it looks like a van and not an RV. I guess more education is needed!

[Boxster1971]

Originally Posted by Janet H

Mod hat on: Several posts have been removed from this thread.

Link to the site rules: https://www.classbforum.com/forums/m...ork&page=rules

Note the bits about ".. offensive comments about race, gender, sexual orientation, religion, and national origin, are not acceptable" as well as prohibitions on political wanderings. Please stick to the topic of the thread; HOAs and parking your rig.

Janet - thanks for cleaning up this thread. Well done!

- - Mike

[booster]

Originally Posted by Boxster1971

Janet - thanks for cleaning up this thread. Well done!

- - Mike

X2

[mumkin]

Yes... Thank you Janet.

Davydd... I looked into these garage style condos down in Shakopee a few years back when I had my Libero, and the price was pretty outrageous. Especially now considering that my B is my only vehicle and I neither want nor need another.

(I see that your rig is now Prince's neighbor. LOL)

[GallenH]

My HOA prohibits RVs. boats and trailers from being in "public view." I could, I suppose drive it into the side/backyard. Or raise the roof on our 3rd car garage (although it's never been used for that.....it's my workshop). There is at least one neighbor (66 lots) who parks a commercial trailer in his drive. And we often have the PW home for repairs or pre/post trip sometimes for several weeks, without anyone complaining. Still we rent a space in a UHaul facility about 1-2miles from us and generally have it there.

But our HOA rules are pretty minimal and I have no objection to them.

[rowiebowie]

Originally Posted by GallenH

My HOA prohibits RVs. boats and trailers from being in "public view." I could, I suppose drive it into the side/backyard. Or raise the roof on our 3rd car garage (although it's never been used for that.....it's my workshop). There is at least one neighbor (66 lots) who parks a commercial trailer in his drive. And we often have the PW home for repairs or pre/post trip sometimes for several weeks, without anyone complaining. Still we rent a space in a UHaul facility about 1-2miles from us and generally have it there.

But our HOA rules are pretty minimal and I have no objection to them.

That's the trouble with HOA's. You have no objection to them, until you do.

[GallenH]

Originally Posted by rowiebowie

That's the trouble with HOA's. You have no objection to them, until you do.

You got it.

[Davydd]

Originally Posted by rowiebowie

That's the trouble with HOA's. You have no objection to them, until you do.

If you believe this, why do people buy into an HOA? I stated my case in great detail as to why I did. There are certain aspects I had to give up that I don't like but I did due diligence and I made a decision on balance. Buyer beware. I don't have much sympathy for complainers especially if it cost me money to have the HOA defend their rules or if my neighborhood and street becomes a parking lot of RVs, boats and work vans that potentially depreciate my property. I agreed to buy based on the rules of the HOA mostly designed to keep property values up.

As I mentioned I gave up property of 34 years of pretty much a wild west attitude in ownership diametrically opposed to an HOA. I never mowed grass and had an annual all day burn "for recreational purposes" after the snow fell to clear our forest of downed trees, limbs and debris.