Baselining my 2001 Roadtrek van?

[rstl99]

Hi all.* Just acquired a 2001 Roadtrek built on a Dodge B3500 van with 318 (5.2) engine.* About 90,000 miles on it (140,000 kms).* The van was mechanically inspected before I bought it and the mechanic told me all was good on it (brakes, front end, suspension, etc.).* I asked him if it was worth doing a compression test on the engine and he said I'd be wasting my money.* About the transmission, he said it shifted well and the fluid was clean and at the right level.* There's a transmission cooler on the van.

After taking possession, I realized the oil and filter had not been changed in a year and a half.* The van has sat in a barn because of illness in the family, after having been taken on a cross-NA trip just 2 years ago.* So I immediately drained the oil and changed it and the filter.

Now I'm wondering: should I go further than that and (1) have the transmission drained, filter replaced and bands adjusted? (2) have the coolant drained, flushed and replaced? (3) what about the brake fluid? (4) wouldn't be hard draining and putting fresh oil in the differential.

I suppose there's always a risk of a shop screwing up the transmission flush, leading to tranny problems.* We've all heard horror stories.

But there would be peace of mind knowing that all the systems have fresh fluids, and I could spend the extra $$ to get some high quality fluids (synthetic where warranted) in there.

So my question is: should I "baseline" the fluids on the van, or leave it as is, drive it and just check the fluid levels going forward, following the Chrysler service recommendations for fluid replacements?

Thanks for your thoughts.

[mkguitar]

been crawling around doing my fluids in the heat



oil and filter ( just returned from 5k trip) due


tranny fluid ( this can be messy but I diy)


for vehicles without a drain plug on the tranny pan, this is when you add a pan with a drain- under $100 at hotrod shop
otherwise siphon out the dipstick tube as much as you can, then dropping the pan for the filter is easier and cleaner



coolant I did already-
monsoon season in AZ- my air conditioner produces gallons of distilled water each day. I save it in jugs for coolant and wiper washer and for washing the car spot free



brake fluid flush in progress


my van is a chev, my pick up a gmc
I tend to do same job on one then the other


if you don't diy, none of these is expensive, just stay away from jiffylube type places
got a good CDN tire near you?
otherwise i know a good shop in ottawa







mike

[booster]

Originally Posted by rstl99

Hi all.* Just acquired a 2001 Roadtrek built on a Dodge B3500 van with 318 (5.2) engine.* About 90,000 miles on it (140,000 kms).* The van was mechanically inspected before I bought it and the mechanic told me all was good on it (brakes, front end, suspension, etc.).* I asked him if it was worth doing a compression test on the engine and he said I'd be wasting my money.* About the transmission, he said it shifted well and the fluid was clean and at the right level.* There's a transmission cooler on the van.

After taking possession, I realized the oil and filter had not been changed in a year and a half.* The van has sat in a barn because of illness in the family, after having been taken on a cross-NA trip just 2 years ago.* So I immediately drained the oil and changed it and the filter.

Now I'm wondering: should I go further than that and (1) have the transmission drained, filter replaced and bands adjusted? (2) have the coolant drained, flushed and replaced? (3) what about the brake fluid? (4) wouldn't be hard draining and putting fresh oil in the differential.

I suppose there's always a risk of a shop screwing up the transmission flush, leading to tranny problems.* We've all heard horror stories.

But there would be peace of mind knowing that all the systems have fresh fluids, and I could spend the extra $$ to get some high quality fluids (synthetic where warranted) in there.

So my question is: should I "baseline" the fluids on the van, or leave it as is, drive it and just check the fluid levels going forward, following the Chrysler service recommendations for fluid replacements?

Thanks for your thoughts.

I would do all the fluids if there is not history or at least carefully look at them all. If the brake fluid is discolored much off of very pale yellow, coolant for sure, power steering fluid for sure as it rarely ever gets done (follow a procedure for your van which will probably have you remove the return hose), sample differential fluid and look at it and probably change it (probably need to remove the cover as most don't have drains), if the trans fluid is clean and doesn't small a pan removal with filter change and refill which will get about half the fluid change. The problems you hear about are usually on units with dirty fluid and cleaned with flush machines which can break loose debris, so if it is clean and you do the half change should be about as safe as you can be.

[55 Nomad]

I agree with everyone. I bought my 2006 C190 in DEC 2019 with only 32,000 miles on it. I changed all the fluids to name brand coolant and synthetic fluids. Now I know what is in it and how old they are. It is all logged in my binder to reference when need. So yes base line it for peace of mind.

[mkguitar]

Originally Posted by 55 Nomad

It is all logged in my binder to reference when need. .

just started trying to use a free app VMT to track all this stuff


I have many vehicles


and yes power steering fluid, did mine last year- that was super easy



mike

[rogerstg]

Agree with all of the above and will add: for brakes, go with DOT 4 instead of 3. The cost difference is low and you have an extra measure of safety from boiling. This from a mechanic friend.

I'm in the process of doing the same baselining to my "new to me" 2002 Great West Classic.

[rstl99]

Thanks for all the suggestions and recommendations about baselining the fluids. The van came with good maintenance records from the first two owners (up to about 8 years ago, when the previous owners bought it) and then almost nothing. I suppose those people did not keep paperwork. They own a farm so probably did some of their own maintenance (oil changes etc.).

Sounds like a good approach to drain and replace the filter in the transmission. Measure the amount of fluid removed, and put the same amount back in.

Likewise a coolant flush and replacement should not be too onerous (will let a shop do it, it's messy and a pain to deal with the old coolant etc.).

For brake and power steering I will inspect condition and play by ear.

I think I will do the diff. Partly because the records indicate that the second owner had the diff go bad (fluid loss?) and needed a complete replacement ($$) around 30,000 miles.

Now to get the fluids and put the coveralls on.

Regards.

[rogerstg]

Originally Posted by rstl99

Sounds like a good approach to drain and replace the filter in the transmission. Measure the amount of fluid removed, and put the same amount back in.

Your owner's manual will have a specific procedure to follow when refilling in order to get all fluid to where it needs to be. It beats measuring amounts removed and blowing out temporary overfill.

For brake . . . I will inspect condition and play by ear.

You can't inspect the potential problem areas, at the brakes, without at least bleeding. Brakes can be a pass/fail issue, with failure happening when most needed, like descending a steep grade with a heavy vehicle.

[booster]

Originally Posted by rogerstg

Your owner's manual will have a specific procedure to follow when refilling in order to get all fluid to where it needs to be. It beats measuring amounts removed and blowing out temporary overfill.


You can't inspect the potential problem areas, at the brakes, without at least bleeding. Brakes can be a pass/fail issue, with failure happening when most needed, like ascending a steep grade with a heavy vehicle.

I think the mess factor on coolant changes is based a lot on experience and if you pull the block drains or not. Just a radiator drain on one with a draincock is not very messy, but some like the Chevies don't had the drain and you have to pull the lower hose off and coolant comes out might fast then. Don't know about the Dodges, but probably has two block drains like most older V8s and they will likely be a bit hard to get out if they haven't already be removed in the past. It is also the best place to check for sludge and rust build up. I have seen them where you remove the plug and nothing even comes out until you poke a screwdriver through the blockage. On my old Mopar V8s when I had them I added petcocks with a barb on them so a hose into a bucket clean after that.


Definitely best to check the brake fluid at wheels, but if the master is dirty no need to do that just change. If there is clean in the master probably most of the time it is OK, but not always. Dot 4 in the vans is a good idea IMO.

[DieselLover]

Tires, Fluids, Belts, Battery, Alternator, Pads, Fuses, Bulbs, Starter. Those would be the way to go as to rejuvenation. Many quality cars recommended a thorough 100K miles rejuvenation and yes it included Alternator and Starter in that list!

Give the service headaches my buddy and use the might as well when not in the middle of a trip and or the road! BTW fluids also includes an AC recharge.

Then you go to the "house side" where the bucket of bolts folks just threw the stuff together in some willy nilly random crazy fashion to create a very high maintenance product with poor design, build and quality! Almost forgot yes not centralized warranty service management and service centers in the market space to speak of.

[rstl99]

Originally Posted by rogerstg

Your owner's manual will have a specific procedure to follow when refilling in order to get all fluid to where it needs to be. It beats measuring amounts removed and blowing out temporary overfill.

You can't inspect the potential problem areas, at the brakes, without at least bleeding. Brakes can be a pass/fail issue, with failure happening when most needed, like descending a steep grade with a heavy vehicle.

Got the shop manual will read on fluid changes (not very explicit on that, the old shop manuals...)

Brakes feel a bit spongy to me, pedal goes down a lot, not firm and limited travel as I like to see. It's been a while since I've owned a vehicle with drums in the back, maybe that's part of it. I have a bleeder kit I haven't used for many years, time to do some bleeding...

I thought my shadetree mechanic work was behind me, but the van may encourage me to get my elbows greasy again. Not fun crawling under there at my age though (65).

[rstl99]

Originally Posted by booster

I think the mess factor on coolant changes is based a lot on experience and if you pull the block drains or not. Just a radiator drain on one with a draincock is not very messy, but some like the Chevies don't had the drain and you have to pull the lower hose off and coolant comes out might fast then. Don't know about the Dodges, but probably has two block drains like most older V8s and they will likely be a bit hard to get out if they haven't already be removed in the past. It is also the best place to check for sludge and rust build up. I have seen them where you remove the plug and nothing even comes out until you poke a screwdriver through the blockage. On my old Mopar V8s when I had them I added petcocks with a barb on them so a hose into a bucket clean after that.


Definitely best to check the brake fluid at wheels, but if the master is dirty no need to do that just change. If there is clean in the master probably most of the time it is OK, but not always. Dot 4 in the vans is a good idea IMO.

Good thoughts on coolant draining etc. When I got the 04 Lexus GX 5 years ago I baselined it a lot, and had to change the rad because of a disappearing coolant issue, replaced hoses, don't remember if I drained the block, but swore that was the last time I did that in my driveway. 5 years later (65) I'd rather pay someone to do it, but hopefully do it well.

Yeah brakes feel spongy, not firm and limited travel on the pedal, so some bleeding may be called upon, have a kit I can dig up. At least this van hasn't been winter driven so all the brakes lines and fittings aren't rusted and seized as we commonly see up here. Nice part of this camper is how little rust there is underneath, for a North East vehicle.

[rstl99]

Originally Posted by DieselLover

Tires, Fluids, Belts, Battery, Alternator, Pads, Fuses, Bulbs, Starter. Those would be the way to go as to rejuvenation. Many quality cars recommended a thorough 100K miles rejuvenation and yes it included Alternator and Starter in that list!

Give the service headaches my buddy and use the might as well when not in the middle of a trip and or the road! BTW fluids also includes an AC recharge.

Then you go to the "house side" where the bucket of bolts folks just threw the stuff together in some willy nilly random crazy fashion to create a very high maintenance product with poor design, build and quality! Almost forgot yes not centralized warranty service management and service centers in the market space to speak of.

hmmm, "thanks" for the looonngg list of rejuvenation items!!
Geez what did I get myself into with a 20 year old camper lol
Anyway, at least the seller had a mechanic go over the van and declare it sound in key areas. Probably the kind of mechanic who favours a "leave well enough alone" philosophy. Others tend to go hogwild, we all find ourselves somewhere on that continuum.

Seller also paid a fair amount to have an RV place go over all the rv stuff and attest all is ship shape and ready to go (with some upgrades and repairs needed here and there - all paid for by the seller). So I'm pretty confident about the "bucket of bolts" part you refer to. HOwever the van is amazingly very stock so some needed upgrades will be called for (LED lights inside, for one).

I agree that ideally a lot of the mechanical rejuvenation should be dealt with before a major road trip.

I should point out the last trip the PO did with the van was lengthy trip to Tuktayuktuk NWT, above the Arctic Circle. That gives me the impression that he maintained his van well, to entertain trips in remote Northern areas like that.

[Gryphon]

I've bought a few used vehicles over the years. What I do is sit down with the owner's manual and make a list of everything that should have been done to the vehicle up to that point (based on age and/or mileage). Unless I have some evidence that those items have been done (stickers, maintenance log, receipts) I assume they all need to be done, starting with engine oil/filter/lube which I usually have done before I even get the vehicle home.

[rstl99]

Originally Posted by Gryphon

I've bought a few used vehicles over the years. What I do is sit down with the owner's manual and make a list of everything that should have been done to the vehicle up to that point (based on age and/or mileage). Unless I have some evidence that those items have been done (stickers, maintenance log, receipts) I assume they all need to be done, starting with engine oil/filter/lube which I usually have done before I even get the vehicle home.

Yeah can't find fault with your approach, which is very sensible.
I have also looked carefully at the manufacturer's recommended service schedule and items. I assume the use of the Dodge van as a camper constitutes "regular" and not "severe" use, so regular intervals would apply. For the transmission, that equates to draining the fluid, replacing the filter and adjusting the bands at 100,000 miles (mine is at 90 now). Severe schedule every 30,000 miles. And so on.

The maintenance records are spotty at best for the last owner (6 years). Prior to that the owners appeared very meticulous in their service. And obviously the condition of the van (inside, outside, underneath) suggests that it has had very caring owners.

I'll find a local shop with lift that can handle the Roadtrek and get them to do the transmission oil/filter/band adjust, and check the diff level. Probably get them to flush the cooling system. The rest I'll handle myself.

Regards.

[booster]

Originally Posted by rstl99

Yeah can't find fault with your approach, which is very sensible.
I have also looked carefully at the manufacturer's recommended service schedule and items. I assume the use of the Dodge van as a camper constitutes "regular" and not "severe" use, so regular intervals would apply. For the transmission, that equates to draining the fluid, replacing the filter and adjusting the bands at 100,000 miles (mine is at 90 now). Severe schedule every 30,000 miles. And so on.

The maintenance records are spotty at best for the last owner (6 years). Prior to that the owners appeared very meticulous in their service. And obviously the condition of the van (inside, outside, underneath) suggests that it has had very caring owners.

I'll find a local shop with lift that can handle the Roadtrek and get them to do the transmission oil/filter/band adjust, and check the diff level. Probably get them to flush the cooling system. The rest I'll handle myself.

Regards.

One thing to think about, IMO, is what category you put the RV version of the van. Many, me included, would put it in "severe" category as it is certainly not at "normal" simply because it is hauling near maximum weight all the time. In particular, things like the transmission, brakes, and rear axle seem to be the more vulnerable ones but a case can me made for other lists based on personal experience.


A comment on preventive change of non failed alternators and starters. I consider this a kind of "only if" decision. If you are replacing with rebuilt starter and alternator level parts, from what I have seen over the years, you probably have as much or more likelyhood of a failure compared to what you have. Many of them are very poorly done by the rebuilders unless you have a trusted shop that do them in house, but that will cost considerably more because they actually replace all the wear parts instead of only what brought the core in. If they still make quality new units, then I would say you would get better expected life, especially if you go with some of the after market upgraded versions, but be prepared for high costs on them.

[rstl99]

Yeah, I thought the same thing when reading the service manual and description of regular vs severe service. Perhaps it could be argued that a fully loaded camper with liquid in all tanks would constitute "severe" service, or should be treated as such. I myself equated "severe" more with the use of this large van for its original intended purpose: delivering packages all day in a city setting, stop and go, short hauls. Or doing a shuttle bus service with seats installed, in an airport or work site setting. Or loaded up with parts and supplies for an electrician or plumber, again making short drives to work sites in and around the city.

But point taken: no harm in treating our Class B vans built on these commercial van chassis as "severe" service in some ways. And certainly, the road trip to the Arctic Circle that the previous owners of my van undertook two years ago classified as "severe" in my books, and probably deserves some good PM service as a consequence!

I think I agree with you about the alternator and starter. One reason I chose a camper built on good-old N-A van chassis is that I figure that if either of those failed while on a trip, I can probably get parts locally almost anywhere, or couriered in overnight. Or a used part from a wreckyard. I used to carry wearable parts like alternator brushes with me when I traveled roads in the past.

Anyway, this has proved an interesting discussion thanks to all your inputs. Thanks!

[rogerstg]

For me, with basically the same van, 2002, and half the miles, I considered time as well as miles. Things like brake fluid and radiator fluid degrade with time, leading to internal corrosion.

Be sure to check the antifreeze type. Mine requires HOAT, but somewhere along the line it was switched to the generic green stuff.

[rstl99]

Thanks Roger, for note about coolant type.
And yes, time and not only mileage play into the equation.
Too bad for me the PO (and his mechanic) didn't seem to pay much attention to the fluids (from what I can visually tell) but at least I'll know they are properly baselined for the next phase of this Roadtrek's life.

[booster]

A lot of people, especially in the late 90s and 2000s, switched coolant out for the green stuff and it isn't really and issue for an old school engine like the Dodges and Chevies as far as I have seen. But, you do have to change in more often. The GM Dexcool fiasco was most of the cause for all of the changing even on non GM cars, I think, as it kind of put the fear in everyone about the new generation coolants.


Dexcool is an OAT coolant and the HOAT ones have not has as much issue in general. If you switch back, it will need a very thorough flush to get all the green stuff out. Mixing with HOAT hasn't been as much issue as with Dexcool as far as I have, but it just isn't a good idea, IMO. Changing to another HOAT, as they all do it differently additive wise is also a possibility there some likely not a problem issue. I personally like to use GO5 HOAT as it seems to have the best combination of additives for the metals in the GM cars I put it in to get rid of the Dexcool. It has been no problem and when I just rebuilt the 1996 Buick 5.7 all cast iron engine it was spotless in all the coolant passages.


I would certainly stay away from the "universal" coolants that claim they are compatible with all types as I don't see how that would be possible to do well.