Any updates on Hymer/Roadtrek/Carado future?

[avanti]

[Moderator's Note]

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[Roadtrek Adventuous RS1]

Bud,

Give it a little time...be patient, the Roadtrek name is coming back.

Regardless of whether you are a recent owner or have an older coach like you and I do..... it's a good thing they are returning.

I'm very happy because it will mean more availability of parts.. etc.

[markopolo]

I hope the Rapido deal ends up happening. That could mean up to 200 jobs in that area. We might not know for several months though.

Reuer said it's hard to say how long it will take to resume manufacturing as the company must still complete its due diligence on the deal, a process that could take several months.

Some members here will remember that there was a plan to reintroduce Westfalia's to North America back in 2012: http://www.classbforum.com/forums/f9...rica-2133.html

I still have the brochure - hard to believe 7 years has passed. I just now looked through that brochure it shows a very nice looking Class B. It had some clever hidden storage and even heated floors.

[Roadtrek Adventuous RS1]

Originally Posted by markopolo

I hope the Rapido deal ends up happening. That could mean up to 200 jobs in that area. We might not know for several months though.



Some members here will remember that there was a plan to reintroduce Westfalia's to North America back in 2012: http://www.classbforum.com/forums/f9...rica-2133.html

I still have the brochure - hard to believe 7 years has passed. I just now looked through that brochure it shows a very nice looking Class B. It had some clever hidden storage and even heated floors.

😁😁😁 Rapido Deal.

[Bud]

"Give it a little time...be patient, the Roadtrek name is coming back."

Can't imagine what that is in response to. Anyway, I get it 'The Name is Coming Back'.

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by markopolo

I hope the Rapido deal ends up happening. That could mean up to 200 jobs in that area. We might not know for several months though.



Some members here will remember that there was a plan to reintroduce Westfalia's to North America back in 2012: http://www.classbforum.com/forums/f9...rica-2133.html

I still have the brochure - hard to believe 7 years has passed. I just now looked through that brochure it shows a very nice looking Class B. It had some clever hidden storage and even heated floors.

I think I remember this effort, did folks from Safari Condo were involved? I vaguely remember talking about it with someone from Canada.

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by markopolo

I hope the Rapido deal ends up happening. That could mean up to 200 jobs in that area. We might not know for several months though.



Some members here will remember that there was a plan to reintroduce Westfalia's to North America back in 2012: http://www.classbforum.com/forums/f9...rica-2133.html

I still have the brochure - hard to believe 7 years has passed. I just now looked through that brochure it shows a very nice looking Class B. It had some clever hidden storage and even heated floors.

Westfalia new plant in Gotha Germany plans to produce 1000 campervans/year with 50-60 folks. I am sure this will be the mind set governing Canadian plant in long term.

From this post #25 http://www.classbforum.com/forums/f9...html#post92261

“https://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/mo...ns-new-factory
Interesting numbers:
“The new factory has around 6,000 square metres of floor space and allows for more expansion in the future if required. It will employ between 50 and 60 people in the first full year of business, who between them will build some 1,000 campervans per
year in Gotha.””

[markopolo]

Originally Posted by GeorgeRa

I think I remember this effort, did folks from Safari Condo were involved? I vaguely remember talking about it with someone from Canada.

Close. It was New West RV. It was about a mile drive from New West RV to one of the Safari Condo locations.

[gregmchugh]

Originally Posted by Bud

""The reports of my death are greatly exaggerated"."

Not really, he's dead along with roadtrek's very dated reputation.

You know the future? If so, let us know.

Bud

Roadtrek seems to still have a very good reputation if you don’t focus on a few internet sites where Roadtrek is not viewed positively. Most current owners are very satisfied and they still have a very large customer base with 30,000 units in the road. Only real issue would seem to me to be the high average age of the owner base. The new company is wise to be targeting a younger group of buyers to have a longer term base of customers as the current customer base ends their camper van use. Good opportunity to use the Westfalia brand for this new market where the buyers are not familiar with the Roadtrek brand but probably do know Westfalia.

[RossWilliams]

I doubt it is a coincidence that the CEO of Westfalia was quoted in the news release about Rapido's purchase of Roadtrek. Just as Thor's purchase of Erwin Hymer Group was a strategic move into the European market, Rapido's purchase of Roadtrek is a strategic move into the North American market.

Of course, EHG's purchase of Roadtrek was also a strategic move. I hope Rapido's deal works out better, just as there are people who reveled in Roadtrek's problems who are hoping it doesn't. Reinserting the Westfalia brand back into North America would be a logical next step, but they should stay focused on Roadtrek in the immediate future. They don't want to repeat EHG's mistake of over-expansion in an unfamiliar market.

[markopolo]

Here's the pdf version of the brochure from when New West RV was planning to bring the Westfalia brand back to NA:


westfalia_columbus.pdf


There's lots to like about it. There was space to hang clothes behind the 2nd row seating. Sleeping for up to 4 or alternately space to store two bikes or golf clubs inside the unit & still sleep 3. Heated floors & froli bed cushioning....

[RossWilliams]

Its interesting they planned to use the Fiat Ducato as a base and it seems like a European design. I didn't see any mention of AC, microwave or black tank. If understand it, the "garage" for bikes et al is also pretty standard on Europe. I thought the idea of a cooler for beverages that was accessible from both inside and outside the RV was interesting.

We saw a Roadtrek Etrek last summer that had all the bells and whistles and came with a built in golf club carrier in the rear. Maybe that was influenced by Hymer's European experience. But the dealer had the unit steeply discounted and was still having a hard time selling it. It sounds like the European market is much different. Younger crowd and short stays. They aren't designed to live in for weeks at a time.

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by markopolo

Here's the pdf version of the brochure from when New West RV was planning to bring the Westfalia brand back to NA:

Attachment 7515

There's lots to like about it. There was space to hang clothes behind the 2nd row seating. Sleeping for up to 4 or alternately space to store two bikes or golf clubs inside the unit & still sleep 3. Heated floors & froli bed cushioning....

It is too unfortunate that they were not successful, perhaps delays in getting Ducato into the NA market caused problems. In 2012 Sprinter was the only option. The Fiat acquisition of Chrysler was finalized in early 2014 if I recall it correctly.

[GeorgeB]

Originally Posted by GeorgeRa

It is too unfortunate that they were not successful, perhaps delays in getting Ducato into the NA market caused problems. In 2012 Sprinter was the only option. The Fiat acquisition of Chrysler was finalized in early 2014 if I recall it correctly.

Back then I was very interested in New West's project to introduce the Westfalia to the NA market. Loved the interior layout and the size and proportion of the Fiat Ducato.

You're right GeorgeRa, apart from what seemed to be a poorly managed company at that time (management changed 3 years ago) the problem New West had with the Westfalia is precisely to get all the certification for the vehicle they wanted to import in North America. They wanted to import not only the Westfalia build but also the FIAT chassis. It was never approved and FCA introduced the Promaster at the end of 2013 which basically killed the project. Also Westfalia just started to regain strength in 2013. It was bought by Rapido in 2011 after going bankrupt in 2010.



More photos at: https://centrelab.smugmug.com/PERSO-...Gn/i-VKnbRKk/A

.

[Roadtrek Adventuous RS1]

Originally Posted by GeorgeB

Back then I was very interested in New West's project to introduce the Westfalia to the NA market. Loved the interior layout and the size and proportion of the Fiat Ducato.

You're right GeorgeRa, apart from what seemed to be a poorly managed company at that time (management changed 3 years ago) the problem New West had with the Westfalia is precisely to get all the certification for the vehicle they wanted to import in North America. They wanted to import not only the Westfalia build but also the FIAT chassis. It was never approved and FCA introduced the Promaster at the end of 2013 which basically killed the project. Also Westfalia just started to regain strength in 2013. It was bought by Rapido in 2011 after going bankrupt in 2010.



More photos at: https://centrelab.smugmug.com/PERSO-...Gn/i-VKnbRKk/A

.

Is this the same vehicle as the Fiat Scudo chassis...?
I think that they are tied to Puegot and Citroen....

Fiat doesn't have a large presence in the USA... and these others like Puegot have even less....

I've personally never been a fan of Chysler products either....

Mercedes Benz Sprinter certainly has issues, but, at least there's a network of dealerships .... just my opinion.

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by GeorgeB

Back then I was very interested in New West's project to introduce the Westfalia to the NA market. Loved the interior layout and the size and proportion of the Fiat Ducato.

You're right GeorgeRa, apart from what seemed to be a poorly managed company at that time (management changed 3 years ago) the problem New West had with the Westfalia is precisely to get all the certification for the vehicle they wanted to import in North America. They wanted to import not only the Westfalia build but also the FIAT chassis. It was never approved and FCA introduced the Promaster at the end of 2013 which basically killed the project. Also Westfalia just started to regain strength in 2013. It was bought by Rapido in 2011 after going bankrupt in 2010.

Bringing RV on not approved vehicle would be a major and very expensive task if even possible for small company. VW Westfalias manufactured in Germany were sold in NA by VW on vehicle approved in NA.

The same situation with Airstream Westfalia, Sprinter was already present in NA.

With Promaster and Sprinter being build here the only chance to bring Westfalia is via Rapido manufacturing site in Canada on chassis build in NA like Sprinters or Promasters.

My favored van from all panel vans is the new Crafter, but I very much doubt to see them here. GM lost the potential of bringing Opel Movano here to participate in tall panel vans market, but their new offer of old Express/Savana with Isuzu diesel could bring new customers. If I would face getting a new B I would seriously consider Chevy with Duramax, very likely more reliable than the Mercedes. Chevy with Duramax and Sportsmobile Pop-Top is $50K. https://www.parkers.co.uk/vans-picku...n-test-review/

[RossWilliams]

Erwin Hymer’s new owner looking for workers

[booster]

Originally Posted by GeorgeRa

GM lost the potential of bringing Opel Movano here to participate in tall panel vans market, but their new offer of old Express/Savana with Isuzu diesel could bring new customers. If I would face getting a new B I would seriously consider Chevy with Duramax, very likely more reliable than the Mercedes. Chevy with Duramax and Sportsmobile Pop-Top is $50K. https://www.parkers.co.uk/vans-picku...n-test-review/

Interesting specs on the Express with the diesel. GVWR up at 9900# but axle weights stayed the some so same size tires likely. GCWR down 3000# with the diesel so less towing capacity. Cargo capacity actually goes down a little bit even with the increased gross capacity so that diesel must increase curb weight over 300#. Barely half the hp and about the same torque as the 6.0 so unless the mileage is hugely better there really doesn't seem to be much compelling reason for the diesel spec wise. Of course, Isuzu diesels have an excellent reputation, but so do the 6.0.


I hope someone has a diesel converter so we can see how it performs in the real class b world.

[mumkin]

Originally Posted by Roadtrek Adventuous RS1

Is this the same vehicle as the Fiat Scudo chassis...?

Fiat doesn't have a large presence in the USA... and these others like Puegot have even less....

I've personally never been a fan of Chysler products either....

That is a Ducato/Promaster in the photo.

Are you not aware that Fiat owns Dodge/Chrysler now and that the Promaster is the Ducato?

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by booster

Interesting specs on the Express with the diesel. GVWR up at 9900# but axle weights stayed the some so same size tires likely. GCWR down 3000# with the diesel so less towing capacity. Cargo capacity actually goes down a little bit even with the increased gross capacity so that diesel must increase curb weight over 300#. Barely half the hp and about the same torque as the 6.0 so unless the mileage is hugely better there really doesn't seem to be much compelling reason for the diesel spec wise. Of course, Isuzu diesels have an excellent reputation, but so do the 6.0.


I hope someone has a diesel converter so we can see how it performs in the real class b world.

Fuel mileage could be similar to Sprinter's small diesel or Chevy Colorado rated at about 25 mpg (30 hwy). For a lightweight RV conversion this size engine could be sufficient. But, the complexity of diesel engines fighting NOx with an urea injection and diesel particulate matter with a DPF is very high. Past warranty replacement of NOx sensors or DPF can wipeout all gas mileage savings. And, DPF is about the cost of a new short block 6l GM engine. https://www.gmc.com/gmc-life/trucks/...economy-rating