Advice on Class B purchase process

[sbslider]

We are considering buying a class B vehicle. To narrow things a bit, our primary focus in a vehicle is 18-22', bathroom in the back, and possibly new but more likely 1-3 years old. Some things I'm wondering are:

New vs used in terms of warranty? Sort of thinking one that has been on a few trips has warranty issues worked out, but is still new enough that things should fail for a bit.
How long do manufacturers warranty's last? Are the transferable beyond original owner?
Dealer vs private sale? things to look out for on both?
Somewhere I saw its good to avoid manufacturers first model year vehicle, as they haven't worked out the issues associated with a new build yet. How would one find how long a particular model has been in production?

Partial list of models on the top of the list are:

Entegra Coach Ethos 20T
Jayco Swift 20T
Thor Dazzle / Twist 2LB
Thor Sequence / Tellaro 20L
Winnebago Travato 59K

What's the difference between the four Thor models (besides $10K of MSRP)? The floor plans all look the same

Thanks!!

[hbn7hj]

Just a personal opinion but don’t put much value in the RV up fitter warranty. If you can fix it yourself, do it. Drive train warranty with the vehicle manufacturer has more value.

[jjrbus]

I have had various RV's over the last 20+ years. No way no how would I buy a new RV. I would want something pre pandemic with minimum 25,000 miles on it. The bugs should be worked out by them. I would also keep about 25% of what I had to spend as something is definately going to break. If buying a 4 year old RV it will need tires in the next couple years $$$$$$ Actually knowing what I know I would not drive on pre owned RV tires and replace right away.

https://www.rvtiresafety.net/

My opinion and worth what you are paying for it!

https://www.motor1.com/news/537319/r...ty-complaints/

[sbslider]

Originally Posted by jjrbus

My opinion and worth what you are paying for it!

Thanks for this perspective though, I really do appreciate it.

[N147JK]

Originally Posted by jjrbus

No way no how would I buy a new RV.

That's good advice. Let's see, I paid 1/10 the price of a new van, and it's 10 times more reliable and much better built than the new ones. Knowing that makes it fun to own and use, instead of a worry and a financial sinkhole.

[Rlum]

Originally Posted by sbslider

We are considering buying a class B vehicle. To narrow things a bit, our primary focus in a vehicle is 18-22', bathroom in the back, and possibly new but more likely 1-3 years old. Some things I'm wondering are:

New vs used in terms of warranty? Sort of thinking one that has been on a few trips has warranty issues worked out, but is still new enough that things should fail for a bit.
How long do manufacturers warranty's last? Are the transferable beyond original owner?
Dealer vs private sale? things to look out for on both?
Somewhere I saw its good to avoid manufacturers first model year vehicle, as they haven't worked out the issues associated with a new build yet. How would one find how long a particular model has been in production?

Partial list of models on the top of the list are:

Entegra Coach Ethos 20T
Jayco Swift 20T
Thor Dazzle / Twist 2LB
Thor Sequence / Tellaro 20L
Winnebago Travato 59K

What's the difference between the four Thor models (besides $10K of MSRP)? The floor plans all look the same

Thanks!!

I know a little bit about this stuff. Currently I have a PW Lexor. Wanting a bit more space of late so have been shopping. You will see Jayco and Entegra offer sister products. I heard this allows competing dealers in the same town to sell the same products but not be in direct competition. If you really want to get the skinny on owners and their opinions. Join the FB forum of owners and wannabees. You can read what owners like/dislike about their vans. Also Jayco, Entegra have forums where you can search if certain models have issues or not. I think Thor may also have a forum. Winnebago Travato is very active on FB. I have looked at way more companies in the last 3 months. Each time I go searching, I learn a bit more about these products. If this is your first rv, best of luck!

[SteveJ]

Poor quality on most anything from Thor is legendary.

[Rlum]

Originally Posted by SteveJ

Poor quality on most anything from Thor is legendary.

I agree. I am currently looking at a Phoenix TRX or Coach House. My primary criterion is a short RV without slide outs. Don't want to spend the enjoyment years fixing up a RV.

[Drf63]

I can relate to your preferences. I purchased a preowned 2020 Coach House Platinum 220 that is 23’ long, without a slide, based on the Ford E-450 chassis.

Buying used allowed us to pay nearly 50 percent less than cost of new. The best advice I’ve ever seen regarding RV warranty coverage is: “The best warranty is purchasing a high quality product backed by a manufacturer with an established reputation for superior service”. Phoenix, Coach House, LTV and PW meet that definition.

The Phoenix TRX was definitely considered as well, and the HD350 chassis would have provided some worthy road handling/driver aid advantages. However, contrasting ‘night owl vs early bird’ sleep habits made the partitioned dual-zone living space in the Platinum 220 a more practical layout for us.

Couples with synchronized sleep schedules can best exploit a convertible sofa bed configuration without need/desire for separate workspace/occasional privacy.

In my view, the additional foot in width and length over say, a Coachmen Beyond (which we first considered) constitutes a worthwhile compromise. Maneuverability and ease of locating parking are essentially alike. The E-450 chassis platform does reduce MPG, but the CCC and tow rating are massively improved.

[jjrbus]

Originally Posted by N147JK

That's good advice. Let's see, I paid 1/10 the price of a new van, and it's 10 times more reliable and much better built than the new ones. Knowing that makes it fun to own and use, instead of a worry and a financial sinkhole.

My take on it is a new Roadtrek like mine will cost $120-$150k. People who study these things say first 2 year depreciation is 25% so roughly $30k Plus sales tax another say $6k That is $36,000 right in the black tank!

Unless I have a catastrophic failure I will get most of my money back should I decide to sell, likely this will be sold at the estate sale. It is an old RV 2001 Roadtrek with 75k on it and needs work here and there. My RV is my hobby so I do not really mind. Well the current problem with wandering is getting a bit frustrating. Thankfully I do not have to be dealing with Chevy and Roadtrek trying to get it fixed!

Well it would not happen with a new one you think BS!

[Rlum]

Originally Posted by Drf63

I can relate to your preferences. I purchased a preowned 2020 Coach House Platinum 220 that is 23’ long, without a slide, based on the Ford E-450 chassis.

Buying used allowed us to pay nearly 50 percent less than cost of new. The best advice I’ve ever seen regarding RV warranty coverage is: “The best warranty is purchasing a high quality product backed by a manufacturer with an established reputation for superior service”. Phoenix, Coach House, LTV and PW meet that definition.

The Phoenix TRX was definitely considered as well, and the HD350 chassis would have provided some worthy road handling/driver aid advantages. However, contrasting ‘night owl vs early bird’ sleep habits made the partitioned dual-zone living space in the Platinum 220 a more practical layout for us.

Couples with synchronized sleep schedules can best exploit a convertible sofa bed configuration without need/desire for separate workspace/occasional privacy.

In my view, the additional foot in width and length over say, a Coachmen Beyond (which we first considered) constitutes a worthwhile compromise. Maneuverability and ease of locating parking are essentially alike. The E-450 chassis platform does reduce MPG, but the CCC and tow rating are massively improved.

Used Coachmen 220 about 4 yrs old are very difficult to find. They are also on my short list!

[booster]

The posts about the huge depreciation on new RVs seem to be referring to class C RVs so would not be the same as we see in class B vans which hold their value a lot better.


Our Roadrek 190 is 16 years old and probably worth about 70% of what we paid for it new.

[N147JK]

Originally Posted by booster

The posts about the huge depreciation on new RVs seem to be referring to class C RVs so would not be the same as we see in class B vans which hold their value a lot better.


Our Roadrek 190 is 16 years old and probably worth about 70% of what we paid for it new.

I don't really understand the focus on "resale value". We focused on how the vehicle was built, the layout, and on the great places it could take us, not on getting rid of it. That resale money is just money and it wont matter one bit one way or another in the end. We try and get outdoors and enjoy our days camping while we still can.

[Drf63]

Originally Posted by N147JK

I don't really understand the focus on "resale value". We focused on how the vehicle was built, the layout, and on the great places it could take us, not on getting rid of it. That resale money is just money and it wont matter one bit one way or another in the end. We try and get outdoors and enjoy our days camping while we still can.

Yes, agreed! Unless you’re into collecting antique/exotic automobiles, under normal market conditions …a vehicle is a rapidly depreciating asset and shouldn’t ever be considered a ‘financial investment’.

There’s far less expensive hobbies one can pursue without the predictable financially penalizing trauma over loss-in-value an overly optimistic RV owner will eventually experience when attempting to sell their mobile money pit.

Unless it serves as a mobile platform for remote work (or exploited as a vehicular billboard for advertising) …use it in good health during your vital years, and consider it only as ‘an investment in pleasure and memory-making’.

[kml123@gmail.com]

Originally Posted by Rlum

I know a little bit about this stuff. Currently I have a PW Lexor. Wanting a bit more space of late so have been shopping. You will see Jayco and Entegra offer sister products. I heard this allows competing dealers in the same town to sell the same products but not be in direct competition. If you really want to get the skinny on owners and their opinions. Join the FB forum of owners and wannabees. You can read what owners like/dislike about their vans. Also Jayco, Entegra have forums where you can search if certain models have issues or not. I think Thor may also have a forum. Winnebago Travato is very active on FB. I have looked at way more companies in the last 3 months. Each time I go searching, I learn a bit more about these products. If this is your first rv, best of luck!

I don't think you will get anywhere near the quality of a PW with the Jayco and Entegra

[Drf63]

Originally Posted by Rlum

Used Coachmen 220 about 4 yrs old are very difficult to find. They are also on my short list!

True. If I recall correctly, I scoured typical RV classified listing sources and the Coach House FB group for about 18 months before locating ours.

The extremely low production volume from the CH Factory (less than 95 total models per year since their beginning in the 1980’s) and most buyers looking for either larger or Mercedes-based rigs …makes the 23’ series Platinum models (220, 221, 232) quite rare (but that fact doesn’t influence resale value).

I continue to pour funds into its modification, because I enjoy visualizing/completing incremental functionality improvements …and for the purpose of ‘making it mine’. I have ZERO expectation of getting but a fraction of the added customization costs back.

[jojobafanzi]

Originally Posted by sbslider

We are considering buying a class B vehicle. To narrow things a bit, our primary focus in a vehicle is 18-22', bathroom in the back, and possibly new but more likely 1-3 years old. Some things I'm wondering are:

New vs used in terms of warranty? Sort of thinking one that has been on a few trips has warranty issues worked out, but is still new enough that things should fail for a bit.
How long do manufacturers warranty's last? Are the transferable beyond original owner?
Dealer vs private sale? things to look out for on both?
Somewhere I saw its good to avoid manufacturers first model year vehicle, as they haven't worked out the issues associated with a new build yet. How would one find how long a particular model has been in production?

Partial list of models on the top of the list are:

Entegra Coach Ethos 20T
Jayco Swift 20T
Thor Dazzle / Twist 2LB
Thor Sequence / Tellaro 20L
Winnebago Travato 59K

Thanks!!

So many questions! jumping into the RV market is a hobby. Please let us know your life experience with owning and using RV's?
With that said, there just is no simple answer as to what RV meets your needs. You have to experience it and ask every RV owner about their machines, why they chose them and what are their likes / dislikes. So here goes my OPINION.... I bought my 2017 RT 170 Versatile used because I didn't want to pay the premium. I owned a Class B Coachmen before so i know these machines are assembled in a factory production line by underpaid, under skilled disgruntled workers. The factory defects are not endless but colossal. Dealership service techs are glorified production workers that are learning on your machine. It is your job to learn your own machine and fix it when you can. You will do a better job especially with the info you get on these RV clubs. We have all been there and done that. As far as warranty, you should be mostly concerned with warranty of the platform vehicle such as if the engine or transmission goes kaput. Other than those big items, just fix it yourself, you are better off. IMHO, get a used machine and run it like you stole it. Screw warranty. Customize it, replace unwanted seats with dressers or wardrobes. Turn power sofas into permanent gel memory foam beds, ect... Make it yours according to your current needs and wants. Address issues as they arise. Never and I stress NEVER allow a water leak in your RV. Fix that right away. By the time I sold my 26 year old Class B, I had all the bugs worked out and the new owner got a BadAss Class B. Bought it at 13 years old for $13k and sold it 13 years later for $10k. Loved every minute I had it. Now I have a newer Roadtrek and new adventures ahead. Enjoy.

[Rlum]

Originally Posted by Drf63

True. If I recall correctly, I scoured typical RV classified listing sources and the Coach House FB group for about 18 months before locating ours.

The extremely low production volume from the CH Factory (less than 95 total models per year since their beginning in the 1980’s) and most buyers looking for either larger or Mercedes-based rigs …makes the 23’ series Platinum models (220, 221, 232) quite rare (but that fact doesn’t influence resale value).

I continue to pour funds into its modification, because I enjoy visualizing/completing incremental functionality improvements …and for the purpose of ‘making it mine’. I have ZERO expectation of getting but a fraction of the added customization costs back.

I admire your patience. A year and half to find a Coach House! Wow! I think if I could or did not find anything in 6 months, I would give up.

[Doneworking]

Seventeen years ago we bought our 2007 Roadtrek 210P. Today it resides in our third garage which is HVAC controlled and the RT is like new. I fix anything that goes wrong myself on the rv stuff and I have the chassis serviced by a local shop that I have used for forty years.

Ten years ago we also bought a Phoenix Cruiser 2350 which we used for extended boondocking and enjoyed the heck out of it until we sold it last summer. We are getting a little older and wanted to just get back to one rv and we decided the RT was the best for this time in our lives.

The quality of our 2007 RT is incrdible compared to new products. It was made when the RT was a family owned company and before it was flipped several tmes and bankrupted.

The Chevy chassis is a proven product with a myriad of folks that can work on it anywhere.

Units like ours are out there all you have to do is be patient and find them, make them your own through modifications and don't worry about what the "resale" value will be in an unknown number of years. We have owned Bs and Cs for forty years now and have really enjoyed the hobby and I have enjoyed doing the work on the rv part of the rigs. I would probably never buy a new one again because of the incredible prices and I truly believe they are inferior to the older rigs, but of course my mind and body are older rigs!

Condition and ownership history counts for something when you are shopping. As far as price, what price is the memory of spending years in beautiful places?

If you want to think in terms of investments, buy a CD. If you want to make memories, buy a B and make it your own and understand it will not be perfect and every layout is a compromise.

[Drf63]

Originally Posted by Rlum

I admire your patience. A year and half to find a Coach House! Wow! I think if I could or did not find anything in 6 months, I would give up.

Well, my statement requires clarification …perhaps I should have said that I was also narrowing down my prospective Class C purchase options during that 18 month period.

I honestly believe we would have been very satisfied with a Leisure Travel Wonder RTB. If Phoenix or PW offered a compact, dual-living zone floor plan on a Ford gasoline chassis …I would have seriously considered that as well. The principle of design priorities and acceptable trade-offs are highlighted in the RV world.