Winnebago Travato with Volta Lithium Battery System

[wincrasher]

Originally Posted by Oliver2017

Ball park estimate...about how much "money" does it cost to just be able to have enough lithium power to run an air conditioner for a couple hours and recharge the batteries the cheapest possible way?

What percentage of the cost for a lithium power system is for recharging? If I wanted to drastically cut the cost for a system...is recharging the angle to go?

It really depends on what kind of air conditioner you have.

In my Xplorer (and the same as some of the older Roadtreks) it had a window style AC unit. I put in a new high efficiency 9000 BTU model. It would run on 55-58 DC amps on full blast.

I put in a new magnum 2800 watt inverter ($1800), 400 watts of solar (from AM Solar ~$2500), the Advanced Magnum Remote ($300), the BMK ($200), four 125 AH Stark litium batteries (I paid $1300 each, but I see they've dropped to $1000 each now) and misc cables & switches ($300). All in, I probably spent 20 hours installing and tinkering.

In the end, I had a system that would run the whole coach. I ran the air for 5 hours and it only got down to 78% SOC. Anything above 60% SOC is an easy day's recharge on the solar alone. So I think overnite is no problem, but you couldn't recharge with just solar alone the next day - it would require some alternator charging or shore power connection.

A big rooftop AC unit is more problematic - the amp draw is going to be closer to 100 amps DC I think. So this size battery bank would only be good for a few hours. If you went with more batteries, then you'd have problems doing recharging without shore power.

So all-in, I'd say a rudimentary DIY system is $8-$10k depending on what you can do yourself. It's not cheap by any means, but it's not impossible either. It's certainly no comparison to the Volta system.

The cheapest possible way to recharge would be your engine's alternator or shore power connection. Without a second alternator, you will be limited to about 40-45 amps off your alternator. Shore power is better - my Magnum inverter will put 100-125 amps into the bank. All these are far below the max acceptance rate of these batteries - which is around 400 amps.

[Oliver2017]

Originally Posted by wincrasher

So all-in, I'd say a rudimentary DIY system is $8-$10k depending on what you can do yourself. It's not cheap by any means, but it's not impossible either. It's certainly no comparison to the Volta system.

Thank you for the detailed explanation of what is needed! I'm guessing what makes the Volta system so expensive at this time is the recharging capabilities. In my case, using shore power to recharge a lithium system will enable me to afford it and meet my two hour max of ac. I am not capable of installing a DIY system so, I am trying to think of every possible way of getting the cost down to meet my one necessity. Very much appreciate learning about your system.

[RoundSparrow]

Originally Posted by wincrasher

I mean, really, what do you want? You expect some kind of completely silent recharging system? How about a 40kw battery? Oh yeah, you want all this on a $60k van too I suppose.

Of course people want things. One of the fundamental troubles with a Class B is weight, not overloading it. Wanting is human nature. Onan generators have always been noisy for people. I owned a 1987 Bluebird Wanderlodge with a 15K Japanese Yanmar diesel generator that was pretty damn quiet given the heavy sound insulation and placement design that Bluebird put into it.

On the other extreme, a Honda EU2200i portable generator for $1000 can run for 6 hours on a tiny tank of gas and can power a portable AC or a properly selected RV AC (or carefully making sure you only power the AC and no other loads in the RV). That's an old trick people have done for more than a decade - as it's a lot less sound than an Onan generator hanging off a typical Class B or Class C. Part of it can come down to being able to move the portable generator to one side of the RV and direct some of the noise.

Low-weight but expensive battery systems are a new approach. These topics are going to keep coming up and people learning the various solutions to the noise issue.

[davedutah]

Originally Posted by wincrasher

A big rooftop AC unit is more problematic - the amp draw is going to be closer to 100 amps DC I think.

FWIW, I think the Travato rooftop A/C systems are about 12 amps. FitRV replaced his with a Dometic Penguin, and it used 13 amps, which he said was slightly more than the original.

https://youtu.be/azX83omvSwQ?t=873

[gregmchugh]

Originally Posted by davedutah

FWIW, I think the Travato rooftop A/C systems are about 12 amps. FitRV replaced his with a Dometic Penguin, and it used 13 amps, which he said was slightly more than the original.

https://youtu.be/azX83omvSwQ?t=873

The 12 and 13 amps are at 120v AC, not at 12v DC. Multiply by 10 and add some more for inverter inefficiency if you are running from the batteries.

[davedutah]

Originally Posted by gregmchugh

The 12 and 13 amps are at 120v AC, not at 12v DC. Multiply by 10 and add some more for inverter inefficiency if you are running from the batteries.

Ah, that makes sense.

[Roadtrek Adventuous RS1]

Originally Posted by RoundSparrow

Of course people want things. One of the fundamental troubles with a Class B is weight, not overloading it. Wanting is human nature. Onan generators have always been noisy for people. I owned a 1987 Bluebird Wanderlodge with a 15K Japanese Yanmar diesel generator that was pretty damn quiet given the heavy sound insulation and placement design that Bluebird put into it.

On the other extreme, a Honda EU2200i portable generator for $1000 can run for 6 hours on a tiny tank of gas and can power a portable AC or a properly selected RV AC (or carefully making sure you only power the AC and no other loads in the RV). That's an old trick people have done for more than a decade - as it's a lot less sound than an Onan generator hanging off a typical Class B or Class C. Part of it can come down to being able to move the portable generator to one side of the RV and direct some of the noise.

Low-weight but expensive battery systems are a new approach. These topics are going to keep coming up and people learning the various solutions to the noise issue.

Of course people want things. One of the fundamental troubles with a Class B is weight, not overloading it

I thought it was "space".. not weight????.

[cruising7388]

Originally Posted by wincrasher

Well, I placed an order for one of these Lithium Travatos. Going to get another G, this time in Granite.

They are selling with the typical Winnebago margins, so although the MSRP for this package is rather high ($29k), it get's discounted in the same way as the rest of the options you may desire. So still figure you can get a Travato full optioned out for the standard 25-30% off MSRP.

What options did you decide on for the GL?

[mitul1976]

Coachmen is also offering an optional lithium ion system in its Galleria class B motorhomes Galleria Class B Motorhomes by Coachmen RV

[wincrasher]

Originally Posted by mitul1976

Coachmen is also offering an optional lithium ion system in its Galleria class B motorhomes Galleria Class B Motorhomes by Coachmen RV

Yes, there are posts about that back when it was announced. A few people have them now.

Currently it's only on their Sprinter models and the battery is small compared to the Volta system. Coachemen's system is the Xantrax package and includes the 600 AH battery from Lithionics. It's all 12 volt, not 48 volt like the Volta. I have the Lithionics battery in my Class A, so I can vouch for it's quality. It's a fairly big box, so I understand that since they install it inside (to avoid thermal protection measures), that's as big as they can go. It's also the biggest battery Lithionics makes, so they would need a 2 battery setup if they wanted to go bigger.

My estimate on the Coachmen is that it's probably good for 4 hours of air conditioning.

[wincrasher]

Originally Posted by cruising7388

What options did you decide on for the GL?

I got everything except for the deluxe paint and the shiny cabinets. The quality on previous vans was poor, and with the granite color, the black bumper covers blend in just fine.

[cruising7388]

Originally Posted by wincrasher

I got everything except for the deluxe paint and the shiny cabinets. The quality on previous vans was poor, and with the granite color, the black bumper covers blend in just fine.

Did you opt for the fixed steps or the retractable ones?

Why do you suppose they have gone to the Max Air exhaust only fan?

[mitul1976]

4 hours of air conditioning sounds about right though there are folks who claim 6-8 hours of air conditioning time with the Coachmen/Xantrex system. But the runtime depends on other factors such as external temperature and other AC loads that are turned on at the time of air conditioning.

[G550]

As a side comment, my 2020 Lithium Travato autostart would rarely work according to specifications. It could rarely be set and if it was able to be armed it was a coin toss as to if the engine actually would start when the coach battery became depleted. Had many dead coach battery mornings on winter mornings with the autostart button still illuminated . W and Volta both were of zero help- 4 dealers including the one which sold it new said they didn’t know how it worked and I should go elsewhere . The argument used by some was since this had to do with the engine starting and dash electronics it was a “ chassis” problem - of course, RAM had nothing to do with this system . After 7 months of futile efforts to have it fixed I tried to sell it wholesale back to the dealer where purchased - the manager said he did not want it because then he would have to fix it . Suggest caution with the lithium products , at least from W-
W really was totally indifferent and Volta initially promised me the moon that they were going to fly techs in or have it shipped to the W factory repair facility - of course , none of this ever materialized - in fact , the VP assigned to my case ghosted me after he asked me to keep a log for a week of the autostart operation. I dumped the van wholesale to another dealer - could not use it in cold climate without a reliable autostart function .

[Snowy]

G550 - what electric load were you using in cold weather that would deplete the large storage of the volta system over night? Were you going to bed with a partially depleted battery? Were you running an electric space heater, or the Truma on electric?

[G550]

The whole autostart issue evolved over time. During the first winter I called W and asked how to set the heater to protect the lithium battery and plumbing . W said to use the electric heat set to 45 d and turn on the tank heater pads. No other loads were on. At first I could set the autostart and it seemed to come on ( as best as I could tell )- but over a month or so the autostart either could not be armed or if I could arm it the engine would turn on for a few seconds and then cut off also turning off the autostart button . Or, the autostart button would remain illuminated but the engine would never start. In either case, the. Coach battery went to near zero by the time I opened the van the next morning . I did get ahold of Volta who said to use the gas heat not the electrical - which I had thought of already - but that did not address the issue that the autostart feature did not work . Volta swapped 2 simple components and then asked me to keep a log of the behavior for a week which I did - when I sent it to the VP he never responded . In talking to multiple dealers , what I found was that W had installed a second generator in the engine for the coach battery— plus supporting electronics in the dash- and no dealer said they would fix them if they broke as they were “ chassis”- which they clearly were not - RAm did not install them . So, I figured I have an autostart feature that did not work and electrical components that 4 dealers told me they would not fix if they broke ( and we know everything breaks ) - so I just felt it was best to cut my losses and sell the van .

[rascorp@cox.net]

2020 Winnebago Travato: How do I know if I have auto start on my vehicle?

[G550]

I think the W Travato became available with lithium in 2019-
I had a 2020. My understanding Was that all lithium Travatos had autostart standard. If you look to the left of the steering wheel on the lower dash there should be a silver button which W installed- it has a plastic rim around it that illuminates when the auto start is armed - there are lots of YouTube tutorials on how to operate the autostart - the problem for me was that my system just did not work- it was very unreliable - both in terms of just being able to arm the system and , if by chance I could arm it , having the engine actually start when it was supposed to. I see your location is Florida - if you are in the south you may never really need the autostart - but if you travel in cold climates and don’t have an electrical shore outlet available it can be a real problem . Had I lived in a warm climate I might have kept the van; but in cold climates the autostart is really a necessity - again , unless you always have access to shore power .

[Bourne]

Searched on Google and forum and can’t find an answer.

Is it possible to add the 4th battery module aftermarket to Pure3 Volta system that comes with three standard

[Snowy]

My understanding is that if you open the Volta box by yourself, you will void the warranty. I would contact Volta directly and ask them about how to go about this.