Volta Power Systems - 48volt Battery Pack

[rowiebowie]

Originally Posted by GeorgeRa

It is amazing that most of B class commercial or DIY are focused on batteries, Li is better, more is better. A prevailing trend, while:

- Most of Bs are overweight,heavy, not overweight
- Most of Bs are under insulated, not a complaint expressed here very often
- Most of Bs are overpriced as compared to Europe, can't argue that
- Most of Bs are for 1 or 2 to sleep not for young families, or that
- Most of Bs are for 2 yep for driving on factory safety tested front seats, I would hope so
- Most of Bs or all don’t have crush or pull tested passenger seats, what?
- Most of Bs are low riders, can't argue that
- Most of Bs have loud heaters, yep, but they heat really well
- Most of Bs have loud AC ………. my new one is not, but my old on sure was
- Most of Bs - am I missing something? most of the above we can't control, but batteries are only limited by your pocket book

Not being argumentative, my responses are just based on my experiences.

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by rowiebowie

Not being argumentative, my resonses are just based on my experiences.

See different crash tests for RV passenger seats:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8NUr5mM3ig

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JuNOarORALM

[rowiebowie]

Not seeing a class b here.

I know roadtrek did not get some of their seats pull tested. Only ones I've heard of.

[Davydd]

Originally Posted by markopolo

You've never had 800Ah of lead acid batteries.

Not 800ah. I'm not that dumb to attempt that. But as I have already said AGMs of that capacity are impractical and maybe impossible in most instances.

[JonK]

One of the limitations of Volta batteries is the physical size of the batteries which seem to be singular for each capacity rating. Given my interior design intentions the Volta battery would have been difficult to install inside. I talked to Lithionics and I could get batteries that would fit. I really liked the 48 volt advantages during the charging cycle so I went with that and incurred the need for more ,complex battery temperature control during charging. Given my use, that tradeoff was ok.

I've tried measuring the input wattage compared to output on the converter, but my clamp-on meter isn't accurate enough. I can say tht the fan forced vents on the converter never seem tp vent hot air.

I'm exploring designing a 48v powered AC system since my current one is loud and an energy gobbler. Stealing components from hybrid or electric vehicles seems a logical way to go and would be far more efficient.

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by rowiebowie

Not being argumentative, my responses are just based on my experiences.

Originally Posted by GeorgeRa
It is amazing that most of B class commercial or DIY are focused on batteries, Li is better, more is better. A prevailing trend, while:

- Most of Bs are overweight,heavy, not overweight
- Most of Bs are under insulated, not a complaint expressed here very often
- Most of Bs are overpriced as compared to Europe, can't argue that
- Most of Bs are for 1 or 2 to sleep not for young families, or that
- Most of Bs are for 2 yep for driving on factory safety tested front seats, I would hope so
- Most of Bs or all don’t have crush or pull tested passenger seats, what?
- Most of Bs are low riders, can't argue that
- Most of Bs have loud heaters, yep, but they heat really well
- Most of Bs have loud AC ………. my new one is not, but my old on sure was
- Most of Bs - am I missing something? most of the above we can't control, but batteries are only limited by your pocket book

Yes we can, with our wallets.

[W9TR]

I think these high energy density lithium systems have some real advantages - but you also should be aware of some tradeoffs.

If you use your RV in cold weather there are low temperature limits for charging and discharging lithium batteries. It is dependent on battery chemistry and construction. Most if not all systems employ some sort of battery heaters for low temperature operation.

Also, you should be aware of the temperature storage requirements for these battery systems. Where we live it routinely gets below -30 F in winter so not sure how storage without heat or shore power would work out.

I don’t have practical experience with these systems so hopefully more knowledgeable people will chime in regarding low temperature operations.

Tom

[Davydd]

We have been over this time an time again. Specifically to the Volta system:

Minimum Charge Temperature is -32F
Minimum Discharge Temperature is -4F
Minimum Storage Temperature is -4F

Underway most Volta systems I have seen are inside the van in a controlled environment and if you maintain that environment underway you can charge and discharge.

If you have lithium batteries in most of the United States you should have a minimum of shore power with a method of maintaining temperatures above 41F. Electric resistant heating pads are probably the most efficient method and you don't need much amp hour rating pads to do so. Most all lithium battery banks are high wattage and getting heat can be from your batteries underway with no problem. Or you should store inside in a controlled environment. If you don't already know this or can't achieve this, then you are not a candidate for lithium ion batteries.

If you live in an environment that will not go below -4F you can disconnect your lithium batteries and store all winter safely without shore power. I doubt you could do that with AGMs.

[Davydd]

Also lithium ion temperatures are the battery temperature not the outside ambient. My experience is the battery temperatures when connected and discharging (in use) remain above freezing for recharging when the ambient temperature drops to the low 20s. That's based on 4.5 years of observation and knowing the temperature of each cell. So I suspect while underway most people will not be out and about in their van in the low 20s. And if so, I would think they would know all this.

[W9TR]

Thanks for the info. I did verify it via the Volta website. Very impressive performance. We live in areas where we won’t be able to meet the storage temp requirement. I guess a garage with power will be a requirement for us.

BTW, AGM’s when charged @ >60% are good down to -40C storage. They self discharge at a rate of 3%/month. Our AGM boat battery sits all winter w/o a charger and has lasted 10 years so far.

[PaC]

Originally Posted by BobHoya

We are considering buying a Winnebago Boldt 70KL that is equipped with the Pure3 Lithium 48volt Battery Pack system - - which includes the battery pack, inverter, dedicated alternator and solar panel. Winnebago states that the a fully charged system is capable of running the A/C for up to 8 to 12 hours without needing to recharge the battery pack. Does anyone have experience with this system? What are the good and bad issues found. Thanks

Bob, I don’t have the lithium expertise of the previous posters but I do have a Boldt 70 BL and can share my experience with it thus far. We picked it up last November and traveled from Mn to Florida without any issues. I have not attempted to run the AC off the battery pack for the duration you mentioned. Just haven’t had the need. We did “test” the Volta system by using the inverter to brew coffee, microwave, charge boat batteries, etc. way more then we typically do and found that after 4-5 days of camping the battery charge was a little <50%. A short drive (~30 minutes) and the batteries were charged back up. We never plugged into shore power even when it was available. We mostly dry camp so no generator use is really nice. The bed and lounging area s are comfortable and the new Mercedes VS 30 is a pleasure to drive. I have Two “complaints” with the Boldt. 1. The van doesn’t come with a spare tire and there’s no room to mount one underneath due to the Volta pack taking up space. I installed a spare tire mount on the back door to solve this. Not having a spare isn’t an option for me. 2. The interior lights are too bright for comfort and there aren’t any dimmer switches. I am replacing the stock switches with dimmer switches this weekend. The only other thing I plan to do is beef up the solar system. Not necessary, just something I like to do. So, we are very happy with our Boldt and will be spending a lot of time at our favorite, remote campsites this summer. Hope this helps.

[JimB]

I think it's the controller with two fans on top that whirs away all the time. It's not obtrusive except on a quiet night. Does anyone know if it can be turned off? I tried all the breakers and fuses in the coach, but nothing stops it! Many thanks, Jim

[JonK]

The 48v to 12v converter does have a couple small fans that I can hear during quiet times. The only way to stop this noise is to turn the master battery switch off. The way my system is wired the converter runs whenever the battery system is turned on. This is probably necessary since my lights, fridge, furnace, and water pump all run on 12v and the fridge needs constant power.

Originally Posted by JimB

I think it's the controller with two fans on top that whirs away all the time. It's not obtrusive except on a quiet night. Does anyone know if it can be turned off? I tried all the breakers and fuses in the coach, but nothing stops it! Many thanks, Jim

[JimB]

I was afraid that would be the answer... makes sense and thanks for your reply. I think I'll put more insulation in the compartment to dull the noise a bit. It's really not loud, just something that you hear when all else is quiet. Thanks again, Jim

[JonK]

Originally Posted by JimB

I was afraid that would be the answer... makes sense and thanks for your reply. I think I'll put more insulation in the compartment to dull the noise a bit. It's really not loud, just something that you hear when all else is quiet. Thanks again, Jim

I've not succeeded in eliminating the noise I did reduce it with a zig-zag baffle lined with sound absorbing glue on's. This also reduced the noise from the inverter. Quieter but not silent, my tinnitus competes.

[avanti]

If the fans run all the time, it would be an easy fix to mod them to only run when needed. You can get a board designed for that purpose on eBay for like $10.