Programming EcoTrek Charging Programs

[joe33]

New to the forum.
I have a 2018 Carado Axion with Lithium batteries, GU, Solar, and 2000W Inverter/charger. Recently replaced the GU regulator (MC-614) and finally got it to work after a lot of searching and help from Nations Starter and Alternator (was blowing the 10A fuse and had blown a 5A fuse I found under the hood).

The regulator has a sticker saying programmed BV=14.0, AV=13.9, and FV=13.7.

I emailed Anthony Scappaticci at KS2 Corp (Lithium battery manufacturer) and he stated that, based upon tests, the new parameters should be 13.5 across the board.

Has anyone tried to program the GU regulator, Solar Controller, and inverter/charger. I have read the manuals and am not sure it is something I want to take on. The inverter/charger may be limited to built in programs.

[booster]

Originally Posted by joe33

New to the forum.
I have a 2018 Carado Axion with Lithium batteries, GU, Solar, and 2000W Inverter/charger. Recently replaced the GU regulator (MC-614) and finally got it to work after a lot of searching and help from Nations Starter and Alternator (was blowing the 10A fuse and had blown a 5A fuse I found under the hood).

The regulator has a sticker saying programmed BV=14.0, AV=13.9, and FV=13.7.

I emailed Anthony Scappaticci at KS2 Corp (Lithium battery manufacturer) and he stated that, based upon tests, the new parameters should be 13.5 across the board.

Has anyone tried to program the GU regulator, Solar Controller, and inverter/charger. I have read the manuals and am not sure it is something I want to take on. The inverter/charger may be limited to built in programs.

Very interesting information, even for those of us without Ecotrek systems. Thanks for posting it.



It seems to be another data point indicating that there is movement toward leaving more "headspace" in charging lithium systems compared to the original specs of only a couple of years ago when 14.7v and held there was the recommended norm from most manufacturers. If the latest information about the last change to the Roadtrek settings helping the durability a lot is true, the voltage change could very well be a major reason why. It could also be an indicator that the folks with drop in lithiums may also benefit from lower voltages.


Big battery banks, especially lithium, really do work the Nations alternator system and Balmar to their limits and most appear to be in thermal cycling, hot alternator turn down, mode a lot of the time. It would be interesting to see if the parts would last longer if the Balmar was used to reduce output to about the average amount the heat cycling gives (about 165 amps based on the limited data we have seen) to prevent the heat cycling and take some of the strain off the parts, without limiting charging time except in very short charge times. Turn down can be done with "belt load" setting.

[markopolo]

The 3.375V per cell (13.5V) might end up getting the bank to 90% SOC.

This chart - https://www.powerstream.com/lithium-...ge-voltage.htm - shows that 3.3V (13.2V) per cell might only get the bank to 30% SOC and 3.4V per cell (13.6V) might get it to just over 95% SOC.

If the cut out protection is set at 20% SOC then you'd be cycling between 20% and 90% so you would be able to use 70% of the capacity you purchased. You'd be able to use 280Ah of a 400Ah bank or 140Ah of a 200Ah bank for example before needing to recharge.

I don't think that the inverter supplied with newer Roadtreks is programmable other than selecting preset profiles. You'd likely have to upgrade to a better brand to get that feature. Across manufacturers, GEL tends to be a profile with lower voltages and no high voltage equalization or desulphation phase. If there's no better preset available then that might be the best choice.

[joe33]

Originally Posted by markopolo

The 3.375V per cell (13.5V) might end up getting the bank to 90% SOC.

This chart - https://www.powerstream.com/lithium-...ge-voltage.htm - shows that 3.3V (13.2V) per cell might only get the bank to 30% SOC and 3.4V per cell (13.6V) might get it to just over 95% SOC.

If the cut out protection is set at 20% SOC then you'd be cycling between 20% and 90% so you would be able to use 70% of the capacity you purchased. You'd be able to use 280Ah of a 400Ah bank or 140Ah of a 200Ah bank for example before needing to recharge.

I don't think that the inverter supplied with newer Roadtreks is programmable other than selecting preset profiles. You'd likely have to upgrade to a better brand to get that feature. Across manufacturers, GEL tends to be a profile with lower voltages and no high voltage equalization or desulphation phase. If there's no better preset available then that might be the best choice.

Looked at the setting on the inverter/charger. Programmed as b-3 (AGM with charge voltage 14.6 and float voltage 13.7) I changed to b-1 (Gel USA with a charge voltage of 14.0 and a float voltage of 13.7). As you said only preset profiles as far as I have seen.

Also information from KS2 Corp "Lowering the voltage will help with life. It may make it more stable as well. At 13.5 you are almost full." Not sure what "almost full" is.

[stevegoldfield]

I would also refer you to the Carado and Sunlight owner's group ( https://www.facebook.com/groups/461889954253973/ ) on Facebook where there has been much discussion of programming the settings. You can program the settings, but you will have to purchase a device that you can plug in to do that. They aren't too expensive. There is also a document on how to do that with recommended settings in that group.

[stevegoldfield]

This page is for Aktivs, but it should also apply to other Hymer Ecotrek systems. https://sites.google.com/view/suiet-...tem?authuser=0 Note that if you are not comfortable making these setting changes yourself (because doing it wrong can cause big problems), you might want to pay a dealer to do it.

[joe33]

Originally Posted by stevegoldfield

This page is for Aktivs, but it should also apply to other Hymer Ecotrek systems. https://sites.google.com/view/suiet-...tem?authuser=0 Note that if you are not comfortable making these setting changes yourself (because doing it wrong can cause big problems), you might want to pay a dealer to do it.

Thanks for the info!

I am OK with doing the changes myself. Hard part seems to be deciding what to change to since there is also an AGM battery being charged. Still haven't found an access panel for the AGM in my Axion, but will keep looking.

Seems like the more I learn, the less I know.

[RV-RDer]

Hi, KS2 corp has some manuals or procedures to program the solar MPPT and they have their own recommended parameters depending on the type of ecotrek system you have, actually there's a device for reprogramming your MPPT via an app for Android, you may contact service@ks2corp.com

[kite_rider]

Originally Posted by joe33

Thanks for the info!

I am OK with doing the changes myself. Hard part seems to be deciding what to change to since there is also an AGM battery being charged. Still haven't found an access panel for the AGM in my Axion, but will keep looking.

Seems like the more I learn, the less I know.

There is no access panel for the cabin battery on the Axion. The battery is bolted onto the frame of the van with 4 bolts in the center near the rear axel. You have to loosen the bolts and tip the battery forward to remove the cables so you can remove the battery. I took the bracket off and relocated the battery under the bed next to the drivers side rear wheel well. I'm much happier not having this hang under my van.

[joe33]

Originally Posted by kite_rider

There is no access panel for the cabin battery on the Axion. The battery is bolted onto the frame of the van with 4 bolts in the center near the rear axel. You have to loosen the bolts and tip the battery forward to remove the cables so you can remove the battery. I took the bracket off and relocated the battery under the bed next to the drivers side rear wheel well. I'm much happier not having this hang under my van.

Thank you Kite_Rider. Good info on what is needed to remove the AGM if needed. I will probably leave mine hanging (2018 Axion). The location you mention contains the ALDE system.

[ContinuousImprovement]

This will get you started. https://sites.google.com/view/suiet-...tem?authuser=4

[JohnnyFry]

Do any of these external regulators feature a settable current limiter? It seems to me that if the alternator could be set to deliver a settable maximum current which could be easily adjustable it would solve many of the problems of the exceedingly high acceptance rate of Li batteries. Say you were down 200 amp Hours and planned to drive for 8 hours that day you could set a current limit of, 35 or 40 amperes. This would ease the load on the system components; belt, overheating, etc.If you were driving for only 2 hours you might opt to set current at 150 amperes.

[cruising7388]

Originally Posted by JohnnyFry

Do any of these external regulators feature a settable current limiter? It seems to me that if the alternator could be set to deliver a settable maximum current which could be easily adjustable it would solve many of the problems of the exceedingly high acceptance rate of Li batteries. Say you were down 200 amp Hours and planned to drive for 8 hours that day you could set a current limit of, 35 or 40 amperes. This would ease the load on the system components; belt, overheating, etc.If you were driving for only 2 hours you might opt to set current at 150 amperes.

The Balmar regulator has a programmable belt load setting which can limit the maximum amperage delivery from the GU. For example, a belt load setting of .85 would decrease the GU maximum 280 amp output to 238 amps. But it can't be conveniently adjusted by owners to meet differing daily driving conditions.

[kmrotterdam]

Some people are now saying KS2 is recommending leaving all EcoTrek modules on all the time. Where is this coming from ... is it really from KS2 or hearsay? ? Should I do it?

[ContinuousImprovement]

I say use one at a time. More efficient. I've heard that too and asked why. No answer yet.

[markopolo]

Re: All EcoTrek modules on all the time

Chris made an excellent point here about C-rate: http://www.classbforum.com/forums/f2...html#post90874

It would apply to both the charge and discharge. If you had a 150A load for example and split it between two modules it would be easier on the batteries and also the module related parts of the system.

[gregmchugh]

Originally Posted by ContinuousImprovement

I say use one at a time. More efficient. I've heard that too and asked why. No answer yet.

How more efficient?

Once you have the parasitic internal power drain under control with the newer versions why not leave them all on all the time and stop worrying about switching them on and off?

[booster]

Originally Posted by gregmchugh

How more efficient?

Once you have the parasitic internal power drain under control with the newer versions why not leave them all on all the time and stop worry about switching them on and off?

Do we know for sure yet exactly how much parasitic they actually have in th new revision?

[chris_g19]

Whoaaaww!!! Don't remove the AGM (might be a basic lead acid) on the charging branch!!!! You'll blow up the alternator generator.

Once the lithiums are full they disconnect, if you don't have a load at that point the back EMF will destroy the Balmsr and likely the alternator as well.

[chris_g19]

Turn them all on while charging from the engine. Then leave on only what you need during discharge. This is all back to the math based on the chemistry, has nothing to do with KS2's design. Not sure why they flipped on that point, since they are a new company I think they are learning this stuff themselves.