This is an extensive discussion about Espar high altitude solutions. A lot of folks on that discussion are engineers. https://sprinter-source.com/forums/i...threads/63606/
For old Eberspacher units there are 3 solutions:
1.Make sure there is no obstruction on inlet and outlet to the combustion chamber, is installation within given guidelines.
2.Lower volume per stroke pump. Installation of two pumps in parallel with simple switch could be an easy solution.
3.HAK (pulse frequency control based on altitude)
The first two are valid for any heater, Webasto or others.
HAK devices are getting difficult to get as all new Eberspachers have altitude compensation built in.
Dennis from Lindenengineering states: “You can get a HA pump from Summit in Commerce City
They are an off shoot of ATTP & Transwest.
Just off of Hwy 70 east of I 76 and west of Brighton Blvd they keep these in stock'
The pump is good up to about 11,000 ft when it too will start to cause the heater to cut out usually with flame outs !
All the best
Dennis”
Those, or course are all for diesel and not gasoline so I don't know how that makes a difference and if it is significant to the gasoline discussion or not. Higher volatility of gas may make the pulse separation amount more critical, it would think, but they probably stay cleaner than diesel when running rich as diesel is pretty dirty stuff.
Do the gas units say anything about the different properties of pure gas vs E10?
We took a chance on the 2014 Promaster—ours is one of the first 5,000 built. Just turned 200,000 miles with no major issues. $650 is much less to risk.
Interesting comparison of risks, Fiat Ducato with 80% Camper Van experience from Europe vs unknown expertise.
Those, or course are all for diesel and not gasoline so I don't know how that makes a difference and if it is significant to the gasoline discussion or not. Higher volatility of gas may make the pulse separation amount more critical, it would think, but they probably stay cleaner than diesel when running rich as diesel is pretty dirty stuff.
Do the gas units say anything about the different properties of pure gas vs E10?
As far as I know gasoline heaters are tuned for different stoichiometric ratio for combustion. Control board, fuel pump are most likely different. Ignition is the same via glow plug.
As far as I know gasoline heaters are tuned for different stoichiometric ratio for combustion. Control board, fuel pump are most likely different. Ignition is the same via glow plug.
Interestingly, there are surprisingly few differences between the B5 (gas) and the D5 (diesel). According to the parts diagram, there are only four differences:
1) The burner tube
2) The control unit
3) The glow plug connection (holder)
4) The glow pin lining and 2 O-rings
The glow plug itself and the fuel pump are identical.
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Now: 2022 Fully-custom buildout (Ford Transit EcoBoost AWD)
Formerly: 2005 Airstream Interstate (Sprinter 2500 T1N)
2014 Great West Vans Legend SE (Sprinter 3500 NCV3 I4)
I thought that gas drivetrain was proved on earlier Chrysler vehicles. If Promaster was available in 2012/13 I would also go with it.
The drivetrain was almost directly from the minivans they had been building for many years so very well developed.
The only questions were if they had enough power for the extra weight, and if the weight would hurt reliability. Still minimal risk compared to using all new drivetrains.
Interestingly, there are surprisingly few differences between the B5 (gas) and the D5 (diesel). According to the parts diagram, there are only four differences:
1) The burner tube
2) The control unit
3) The glow plug connection (holder)
4) The glow pin lining and 2 O-rings
The glow plug itself and the fuel pump are identical.
That is pretty much all of it. You only have a motor, casting, and case left.
The standard temperature for 10,000ft is around 23F. 10,000ft and 50F is a density altitude of 11,000ft so for a stoichiometric flame at that density altitude would require a furnace capable of 11,000-12,000ft. Just an FYI.
I only need 10,000ft a couple of weeks a year. Using propane at that altitude would work. My long stay is at 9000ft which a 10,000ft furnace should handle. I’m tired of decoking a Webasto.
The standard temperature for 10,000ft is around 23F. 10,000ft and 50F is a density altitude of 11,000ft so for a stoichiometric flame at that density altitude would require a furnace capable of 11,000-12,000ft. Just an FYI.
I only need 10,000ft a couple of weeks a year. Using propane at that altitude would work. My long stay is at 9000ft which a 10,000ft furnace should handle. I’m tired of decoking a Webasto.
If I would be in your situation, I would strongly consider old school of adding a second pump in parallel. Find out from your pump specification volume per stroke and get one with lower volume by let’s say 25%. You can tune the volume reduction for a target altitude by oxygen content. Follow Eberspacher manual for installation.
It would be fully manual, by electrically switching between pumps you can keep healthy flame in both altitudes.
My second choice would be either Eberspacher S2 or S3, my heater is very quiet, but DC brushless motor is extremely quiet.
My second choice would be either Eberspacher S2 or S3, my heater is very quiet, but DC brushless motor is extremely quiet.
Messing with a diesel dosing pump is problematic. Webasto says the gas flame goes out above 5000ft if the mixture is correct. If Velit doesn’t deliver or fails I’ll probably go Espar.
Really happy with the Webasto at 900ft! Puts the Suburban back in the stone age but propane doesn’t have a coking problem.
Evidence of good will by VeLit: A guy on the PM forum put down the $300 deposit, then couldn’t wait out the delays. He got a full refund the same day he asked for it.
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2014 Promaster 136" Self-Build has passed 250,000 miles
I also had to postpone the delivery I had been so anxiously awaiting. What irony!! We won’t be home long enough to install it til mid-June.
The Webasto, perhaps sensing that its days are numbered, has performed flawlessly for the last 12 hours at 6,400 ft. It has run as high as 7,400 ft this trip.
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2014 Promaster 136" Self-Build has passed 250,000 miles
I chose to redirect to Moab Mail Center rather than inconvenience my neighbors. Don’t want to tear everything apart for the install as the Webasto works very well here at an altitude around 4000 ft. The first person that gets one running let us know in a new thread.
I have already adjusted my cabinetry to accommodate the larger unit. I also bought a new foam floor gasket from Webasto because we mount on the ridged van floor—verified size with VeLit.
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2014 Promaster 136" Self-Build has passed 250,000 miles
Linear Mode
