Do we need a generator?

[Lou]

I having been a member of this forum for years and finally we have our own Class B (traded in the C)!!! It is a 2008 Pleasure-Way Excel. It doesn't have a generator and we have a quote to install one (the Onan one that is meant for it). However, $3700.00 is more than we want to spend right now.

Without electrical hook ups, I know we need it for air conditioning & micro but other than that can the battery handle everything else?

We seldom have electrical hook ups because we like to stay in provincial parks, are travelling most days of a trip, don't watch TV. I'm worried because it has one 12 volt battery and as I understand it there is no easy possibility of changing that. I expect the most likely problem is having to use the furnace which seemed to use up a lot of battery power in our class C. We are used to having two 6 volt batteries and have never run out of power. I have tried to read everything on the forum that is related to this but I am still confused.

I am so thrilled about having a class B. Because of its shorter length, we are allowed to park in front of our house so we can just wander off whenever we feel like it. Previously, it was too much hassle to go away just for a couple of days.

[RSchleder]

We have owned several class A DPer's and now own a Winnebago ERA ( class B on a Sprinter chassis). We have always had a generator on all of our units including the ERA. I do agree, the furnace uses quite a bit of "juice" and will drain your battery overnight ( or close too it). We also own a 13' Scamp travel trailer without a generator and only a single 12v battery. Our solution for the Scamp was to buy a Yamaha inverter 1KW generator ( Honda makes one too). This unit is small, light weight and built into a plastic frame with a handle so it is easy to store and carry. 1 gas fill will run it all night and since it's an inverter type generator, it's very quiet even compared to any onboard generator we've ever had or heard. Price wise they are in the $500-$600 range. This unit is too small to run your A/C, however, you can buy a 2KW generator from Yamaha or Honda which WILL run everything PLUS your A/C unit. It is, of course, almost twice the size/weight/price of the 1KW generator so you need to take that into consideration. Hopefully this will help you with a cost effective method of having the benefits of a generator without the $3700 price tag. As far as anyone telling you if you need a generator or not is tough to answer as we all camp a bit differently resulting in power requirements that fit our style of camping. Best of luck!!

[mlts22]

Whereabouts in the US do you live? I live in Central TX, and come 110+ degree days with high humidity numbers to match, the dash A/C just won't cut it. For any type of comfort, an AC on top with a generator is a must.

If I had my choice, I'd go for the Onan, just for the run time available when it is connected to the gas tank.

However, a portable generator can do the job, provided it is well secured so it doesn't sprout legs and wander off. I'd consider a Honda eu2000is Companion. The reason being is that you can plug your 30A cable directly into it (with an adapter), and if you need more than 2000 watts, you can pair it up with another Honda 2000 watt model with just the cables.

[Rok]

My wife is camping in the Olympic Natl. Park and we just finished a conversation about this same issue a few minutes. Apparently the inverter didn't even like here using the Keurig coffee maker with the batteries at 70-80%. We have a 2013 Great West Legend SE, with 2 batteries and thankfully we do have an Onan propane based generator on board so she can make her coffee and microwave something and recharge the batteries. She's been dry camping for a couple of days now but her driving around the park has kept the batteries up quite a bit.

When we were at the Mother Earth News Fair in Puyallup, we had hookups, but I was glad we had an air conditioner, and it was only in the 80's. Since it seems that the only way to dry camp and use an A/C unit is to have a generator, I would consider it pretty much a necessity. Our rig is one of the few black rigs our there--so that might make a difference.

I think that a rig needs a generator "just in case". I've talked to a number of other people who have hardly used their generator over the years, but I haven't heard of any of them say that they felt they could have done without it during those times they needed it.

Just my 2 cents. YMMV.

...........Rocky

[Ron J. Moore]

I think I would pass on the Onan, and opt for the Honda 2000i Inverter Gen. I say this based on the cost of the Onan, the cost savings with the Honda. Also, I like the versatility the Honda would offer, these little guys come in real handy when the power goes down, or you need power away from your home. Safe travels, Ron.

[Lou]

Thanks to all of you for your advice.
We live in Vancouver BC where the climate is similar to Seattle's. Here on the south coast of BC, or Vancouver Island or even the Washington & Oregon coastal routes, 99% of the time we haven't felt the need for air conditioning other than the dash air. When we head into the Interior of BC, Washington or Oregon we always make reservations for places with electrical hook ups.
Our biggest worry is the furnace fan using up the batteries. In midsummer, even coastal parks in Oregon can get very chilly sea breezes on the sunniest of days.
Now that my husband is also retiring I knew we would eventually need a generator to do wandering type visits to hotter climates but it sounds like we would have fewer worries if we start looking for one sooner rather than later.

[mlts22]

If I were to buy a portable generator for those exact conditions, I would buy a Honda EU2000i Companion. A 1000 watt generator is so close in price, why even bother with that unless the couple cubic inches in size difference are that big a factor.

This generator should do virtually everything you need, maybe even run the A/C without issue.

[yizit]

We have a Honda 2000 and used it with a 15' TT. It would run the AC, but you could not run anything else with it. Not a big deal to us. When we wanted to run something else, we just turned the AC off. We currently have an Owen on our RT, don't use it very often, but glad we have it when we need it. The disadvantage of using the Honda is carrying the gasoline needed to run it. You don't want to store the gas inside the van, which means to store it on a carrier or in a trailer. The 2000 is not very light in weight. DH said he would never use the Honda with our RT or any van, when the Owen is a lot more convenient.

[Ron J. Moore]

You said the Onan was $3700.00 - the Honda is about $1K, that weighs heavy - IMHO! Safe travels, Ron

[mlts22]

The Onan's main advantage is convenience. Need A/C, mash the button and it turns on. You can also buy add-ons like Morningstar's or Magnum Energy's generator controller that will automatically fire up the generator if the house batteries get low (user selectable -- I'd do it if it dips under 12 volts), and how long it will run. Some EMM systems like Onan's EnergyCommand actually will fire up the generator, wait until it is fully started, then allow the A/C to start via thermostat.

Plus, you can run the Onan inbuilt while on the road. Here in Texas where a dash air isn't going to cut it with the humidity and 110+ degrees, the roof A/C + generator is a must.

However, in cooler climates, making sure to have power for the A/C isn't an issue. In Europe, few of their vehicles have onboard generators.

[markopolo]

Re: 1 battery and the furnace. I think most Class B Van furnaces draw just under 3 amps. The single battery might be 100 ah. which in practice typically means 50 amp hours useable. So you should have enough capacity. Regular incandescent RV interior bulbs can draw 1 to 2 amps per bulb. Newer RV fridges also need 12v to run the electronic controls. So suddenly the combination of things really starts to add up. You mentioned that you don't watch TV so that helps. Switching to LED interior lights will help if you find the battery doesn't last long enough. Adding a second battery would be great if possible. It is a recommended practice that the two batteries will be the same type, brand, capacity and age.

Re: generator - I don't have a generator. If I find that I need one I will most probably buy a small Honda or Yamaha like Ron mentioned. I know I won't spend the money on an Onan but........ my RV is old and the nights here are usually cool anyway. For your newer PW, a built-in one would be really nice. If it is raining or lots of bugs out then starting the generator from inside the rig would be so nice.

I'd make a lot of phone calls shopping for a better price for an Onan and I'd also look in the US before completely giving up on that idea.

If finding a campsite with electricity will always be an option when it is hot weather then you probably will be fine without a generator. $3700 would cover the cost difference between no hookup sites and full hook up sites for many nights.

Try it out as it is first. You'll soon know if you must have a generator. The one time that we were so glad to have a built in generator (on another RV) was because of mosquitoes at a campground near Crater Lake in Oregon. They were so thick we just couldn't stay outside. Inside the RV was hot and it was great to start the generator and turn on the air conditioner.

Edit: mlts22 made his post as I was typing mine and already covered many of the points I'm mentioning.

[Davydd]

If you buy a Honda portable generator then you are going to need a hitch cargo carrier to transport it. There is no room in a B for it with gasoline in its tank or its attendant gas can.

I've managed to travel over 100,000 miles in my two Bs covering an estimated close to or more than 400 nights of camping and put a total of 24 hours on my first B generator and 10.5 hours so far on my current B with 47,000 miles. I doubt we've run our air-conditioning a half dozen times and never with the generator running. We just plan our trips carefully to follow the weather. We have both a side and rear door bug screen to open up or B completely to stabilize the temperature. We live outside as much as we can when camped. If it gets truly oppressive heat wise we seek out an electrical hookup. The generator is a last resort. There is just nothing more obnoxious in a campground.

[gordonhks]

My experience and views are similar to Davydd's. We tend to follow the weather when we trave. In 2.5 years and 30K miles, we only had one occasion that we had to have A/C on at night. We had left Lee Vinings CA just outside of Yosemite and were on our way to Zion. We reached Hurricane Utah at about 5pm. We were ready to settle in for the evening at a local Walmart as we often do on "travel days" I checked the weather on my Android phone and the LOW for the night was predicted to be 100. I thought about the fact that we would have to run the generator all night, and thought that was not a very pleasant way to spend the night. We located a campground nearby, and paid a little bit of a high fee ($30) and spent the night comfortably plugged in to shore power with the A/C running.

All that having been said, it is sure nice to have a generator every now and then, when we need to run the microwave. Our new 2013 GWV has a 2000 watt inverter and two 12v AGM batteries with a combined 220Amp Hours. In theory, we should be able to run the Microwave for most meals, but we have not tried that yet. There has been a lot of speculation on this board that a very rapid discharge, like the use of a microwave drastically lowers the usable battery capacity.

In summary. My view of RV'ing in general, is that you should go with the solution that puts you in the most discomfort that you are willing or want to live with. The lower that hurdle the lower your cost will be. In addition, you will also increase your access to cool stuff and have less stuff to maintain.

I follow a blog of a lady that uses her Prius as an extended use RV. I am not interested in living with that level of discomfort out on the road.

[jrobe]

Carrying a portable generator sounds like an inexpensive alternative but you have to include a hitch carrier and a secure and lockable metal generator box. Some of the better boxes can be $400-800. Then there is still a significant theft risk.

Then you have to carefully consider the size of generator that you need to run your AC. A single Honda 2000 watt generator is borderline for an 11,000 BTU AC. I would want two Honda 2000's in parallel or a 2400 or 2800 watt generator. The advantage though is that they would be quieter than an Onan but the cost may not be all that much less in the end.

[Mike]

The weight is also an issue when the generators start to increase in capacity. I recently purchased 2 PowerHouse 2100W inverter generators, and a parallel kit, and they are heavier than I had hoped, weighing in at around 90lbs. each with fuel. The 3100W solo option was in the 135lb. range without fuel, so I went with the 2 smaller units. I don't think I could have managed 135-145lbs. easily by myself. The 2 smaller units are awkwardly heavy, but manageable.

A built in Onan has no weight (in terms of ever having to lift it), and theoretically no theft or fuel supply issue, unless they take the whole van. I agree with mlts22, if you decide to get a generator, go built in Onan. The convenience of push button remote start is worth every extra penny, particularly in adverse conditions, as described by our esteemed forum Admin. It sounds like you prefer off grid boon dock camping based on some of your comments, and you'll be glad you got it, when you really need it. It gives you greater choices in where you can stay, you're not forced to look for hydro hookups in hot weather, necessarily. It will also add some sell on value to your unit, too. Some people won't even consider an RV without a generator. And, lastly, in a real emergency where your home power goes out, you can use the Onan in the van to provide some power, by using extension cords. It works the same as a standalone generator.
I would pursue the installation south of the border. You may get a better deal on parts and labor. Just declare it (or not, your choice) and pay the HST on it at the border.
Just my opinion.

[teachergal]

Hi!
I have a 2011 PW Plateau (Sprinter) with a single 12v battery and no inverter....I do have a onan propane generator. The only things I need the generator to run are the microwave and the AC - everything else will run on the 12v, including the TV. I have a portable "plug it in to the cigarette lighter" inverter that gives me 1 outlet for charging stuff. I do mostly dry camping in National Parks and National Forests and such. I can go about 2 nights without charging the battery. Usually, I have to drive somewhere since my RV is my only vehicle and that takes care of charging the battery, but, when I want the power, I'm glad I have it. I don't frequently run it in the campground - if I do it's usually only long enough to heat up dinner in the microwave, but if I need to charge the batteries I run it longer. On my upcoming trip across the country to CO I'm already planning to stay at campgrounds b/c I'm anticipating that it will be too hot to sleep at Wal-mart w/o AC, although I have stayed at Wal-Mart and run the generator all night in order to have AC - it also works to block out noise and makes the bed vibrate (can be good or bad depending...there are some establishments that charge a quarter to get the bed to vibrate), however the generator changes speed depending on the load and that makes it hard to use it as "white noise" to get to sleep. Also, it's very nice when I'm traveling to just pull off into a rest area and heat up dinner in the microwave and not have to worry about stopping at a restaurant!

I'd also wonder just how much propane the generator uses per hour and how the cost of propane for running the generator compares to the $30+/night for a campground...esp if the only reason I'm at a campground vs wal-mart is so I can get a hook up for the AC....running the generator at wal-mart might be the economical choice!

Anyway, I'd recommend getting the onboard generator - I know it's expensive, but the convenience can't be beat!

[Davydd]

Teachergal, you do have an inverter. My Pleasure-way had a 450w inverter that allowed the 120V TV to run on the battery. That inverter has two 120V outlets that would allow you to charge iPhones, iPads and such and even should run a laptop computer. Your dash has two 12V outlets, one is hot all the time with engine off and the cigarette lighter intended one is only hot when the engine is running. Also, you have the 12V outlet where the antenna amplifier button is.

[teachergal]

Davydd,
When I 1st got my coach both you and the previous owner mentioned there being an inverter behind the TV. My dad and I both have combed that area and haven't come up with anything that resembles an inverter. There are no plugs nothing... There's a cord that plugs into the TV, but it's like a power adapter cord - tiny little circle plug - like a headphone only different. It's been awhile since I've looked back there, but we finally determined that the TV does in fact run on 12v and therefore doesn't need an inverter. I know the TV runs on 12 b/c I can (and have) watched TV while dry camping. I can look again next week when I go get the RV for a camping trip, but I'm pretty sure PW changed their TVs...

[Davydd]

Teachergal,

Here is the 400W inverter for the TV in my former 2005 Pleasure-way Plateau. It was located on the wall inside the TV cabinet. You would probably know if there was an inverter because there would be a fan noise. My original TV was built in and not movable, and the inverter with its duplex outlet plugs was inaccessible. P-W later made the TV so it would swing out from the cabinet. When I upgraded to digital I put in a TV I bought at Target and mounted it on a swing arm. I was then able to use that inverter for other things. My Great West Van has a 750W inverter that inaccessible but the plug in duplex outlet is exposed. It also has a USB plug in for iPhones and such.

[Mike]

Why not send a quick email to, or call, PW and ask them about it?
Surely they would be able to tell you if there's one hidden behind something somewhere in your model year, or whether it was discontinued for some reason after 2005?