water vapor gas kits

[lightspeed]

i was wondering if anyone else has ever tried these kits and got anything from them as of better gas mileage ? i tried different ones and never could seem to ever get any better gas milage out of using it , and did as they said and different ways . Although some people are quick to just say it won't work , what i want to here from is any other people who built it right and it actually did or didn't work .

How to build a simple, yet effective, HHO generator

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-3LVhNj5 ... _embedded#

!
I made one like this with stainless steel spatual's cut down to fit in a jar , only i didn't use rubber lid i used a plastic lid .

http://www.hho-hydrogen-car.com/index.html

[booster]

I haven't seen these used for mileage, but there have been lots of "water injection" kits made, that make all kinds of claims about mileage and other things. We have an early, computerized, variable, system on our 1970 Challenger (turbo V, but its function is to prevent detonation. It does that very well. The other thing that water/vapor systems do is clean the combustion chambers. If we run the water for a couple thousand miles, the heads are spotless when removed.

[Flashman]

Well....

Those who say it's theoretically impossible are wrong, they don't even know what theory they should be using most of the time, however, those who say it's easy don't know much about the theory either and many of them "got lucky".

There are a ton of self deluders into this as well, when they fit the kit, fill the tank, drive 100 miles and can only get a cupful of gas back in, what happened? .... the gas in the tank expanded.

The reality is that there is a relatively narrow range of parameters for this to work, and it's a little different for every engine... and that's before you start fighting the computer controls.

I know a smart guy, builds engines for economy and power, lost his shirt in trying to commercialise this and related technologies. The potential is there, but individual engine setups are just different enough that you can't write a recipe for success that works on all of them.

All this is really to say, that this is best classed as "experimental" and there's probably no pre-existing magic recipe for your particular vehicle.

Other factors...This isn't going to cure below par engine performance or bad driving habits, if you can't get "stock" economy, there's something wrong.

I have been researching this seriously for 5 years or so, but I don't have a system on my vehicle yet, it's taken me that long to sort out the BS and find the right science to work with...then I've been "test benching" various setups in my head and finding problems, I'm somewhere near something acceptable that I would try running on a car now, but it still needs lab work to settle a few parameters.

A brief summary of why it can work, and what one needs to research into to make it work.
i) engine efficiency is not the same at all RPM and VARIES WITH LOAD
ii) engine efficiency is affected by the thermodynamic properties of ALL of it's inputs. (And we're not talking pure air and gas any more)
iii) Most of the energy in gasoline is wasted, sometimes as much as 85%, according to where in the operating range the motor is, this can be scavenged internally or externally to increase the total efficiency of the system.
iv) electrolysis efficiency is determined by it's TOTAL energy input, at room temp 70% comes from ambient temperatures.
v) it's really important to remember that you're not going to get free energy, it's coming from somewhere, you're just redirecting it to be more useful.

regards,

Flashman.

[Flashman]

Some notes for RVs...

Are you relying on your alternator to charge your house battery fully while on the road, and depleting an amount of power at it each stop? If yes, then you really don't have spare capacity to run a HHO system.

If however, you're getting unmetered "shore power" at each stop, and have a house battery and solar anyway, then you could use these on the road plus what your alternator can output, to get a sort of light plugin hybrid effect. Recharging your house battery on shore power.

Safety, DO NOT wire the HHO to come on with the ignition, have it switched separately, you need to purge the remaining gas out before you stop for the day, you do not want it leaking into your unit while you're trying to cook, it would spoil your whole day. i.e turn it off and idle the engine a minute or two, or turn it off when you get to the campground entrance.

RVs have large motors, this necessarily means you're going to need a large area/volume of cells to feed it.... you're not going to see much with a 1lb mason jar, think in terms of something the volume of the average picnic cooler.

[Mike]

Originally Posted by booster

I haven't seen these used for mileage, but there have been lots of "water injection" kits made, that make all kinds of claims about mileage and other things. We have an early, computerized, variable, system on our 1970 Challenger (turbo V, but its function is to prevent detonation. It does that very well. The other thing that water/vapor systems do is clean the combustion chambers. If we run the water for a couple thousand miles, the heads are spotless when removed.

Kowalski? Is that you?
I thought you were dead.......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pA4ymmXa8rs

Seriously, a clean engine might be a slightly more efficient engine?
I can't imagine these things are anything more than snake oil if noticeably better mileage is the
intended result. Based on what I've read on some interested websites.

[booster]

Originally Posted by Mike

Kowalski? Is that you?
I thought you were dead.......

Seriously, a clean engine might be a slightly more efficient engine?
I can't imagine these things are anything more than snake oil if noticeably better mileage is the
intended result. Based on what I've read on some interested websites.

Great movie, have seen it many times. Gotta love the free spirit with nothing to lose.

Ours is a 340 twin turbo, EFI, aftermarket 5 speed, set up to handle and drive not drag (unusual). 600hp @15psi on pump gas, 19mpg. We have had it over 25 years, bought used, stock, and did all the mods, engine, turbo, paint, bodywork, etc at home.

[AZ ADVenturist]

Sweettt CAR - Very Cool!

[Mike]

Originally Posted by AZ ADVenturist

Sweettt CAR - Very Cool!

Ditto, that's a sweet ride.
I saw *that movie* when it first hit theaters. Very cool, but the ending was disappointing.
All I could think was "why did the car have to get wrecked???" followed by "I gotta get me one
of those!!!".

[booster]

Originally Posted by Mike

Ditto, that's a sweet ride.
I saw *that movie* when it first hit theaters. Very cool, but the ending was disappointing.
All I could think was "why did the car have to get wrecked???" followed by "I gotta get me one
of those!!!".

They probably wrecked a lot of the cars in the various stunts, it appears. Most folks who have checked out the ending in detail claim the final car was actually a Camaro.

If Kowalski had and RV, it would have to be a "B".

[Mike]

I vaguely recall that rumour about the Camaro.
Hollywood continuity isn't perfect, for sure.
I remember that car chase in the Burt Reynolds flick "White Lightning" where he's hammering
a manual Hurst shifter supposedly in Ford Galaxie LTD with the "police performance" package. After
he loses the pursuit, and pulls in to the driveway at his destination, he clearly puts the car in "Park"
using the automatic transmission column shifter.
Ooooops.