Roadtrek owner manuals from 1987 to present

[markopolo]

Roadtrek owner manuals from 1987 to the current models are located here

http://www.roadtrek.com/manuals.aspx

I've always been impressed that they took the time to do this.

[Oboeterry]

I've seen this site... is there anywhere I can find the floor plans for the older RT's? Thanks!

Terry

[markopolo]

You'll find some in older brochures

Link: http://www.roadtrek.com/brochure_list.aspx

[hornetv6]

It's too bad they don't make one for the Ranger.

[markopolo]

The new manuals including the Ranger are coming soon. In "about a month" is the official word.

[markopolo]

The new Roadtrek owner manuals are available here: http://www.roadtrek.com/manuals.aspx

Chevrolet 170-Versatile
Chevrolet 190-Popular
Chevrolet 210-Popular
Chevrolet Ranger RT
Sprinter RS-Adventurous
Sprinter CS-Adventurous
Sprinter RS E-Trek
Sprinter SS-Agile

[booster]

Interesting, and a whole lot better than the old ones were!

I just went quickly through the e-trek and CS manuals. e-trek still says 1600AH of battery (not rated at 12v obviously), the CS says 190/380AH so must be at 12 volts. That would also indicate you can't get the 8 batteries in the CS, I think. Generator is listed for the CS. Run time on battery specs are non-existent and lots of warnings about using too much power from the AC, cooktop, oven, instant water heater. Glad to see they are more realistic of the real world. CS says not to run the AC while driving off the 2500 watt engine generator and inverter for very long, and not at all on propane while driving. e-trek says 6 year warranty covers batteries, but was a bit sketchy as to defining defective batteries down the road.

There was a section on charging that listed the 3500 watts from the engine generator, the charge from the shore power charger, the solar charger would all be available to charge, but I don't think they really would unless the charge voltages matched perfectly. Maybe I misunderstood how they stated it.

Seeing it all in one place about the e-trek and CS seems to confirm what appeared to be coming, mainly that even Roadtrek is backing of the air conditioning on batteries, as it was not really mentioned in the manual. Because of that, the e-trek would be a tough sell in hot areas, at least to us, as there is no way I would idle the van all day or night. With running the AC off batteries out of the picture, the CS really looks like a much better option with solar, propane generator, 380AH of batteries, and the 2500 watt engine generator, plus a better layout IMO. You could be off grid pretty much as long as you wanted, and had propane and tank space (plus some sun).

Glad to see that they are getting their literature in order, it has been a weak spot for a long time, and probably one of the biggest complaint areas on the Yahoo Roadtrek forum.

[markopolo]

I'm glad to see current manuals available too. I haven't taken a look at any yet but probably will soon.

[peghan]

Have they taken that down? I get an error message

[gregmchugh]

Still there under the Support link on the homepage, here is the oldest one online from 1987...

You are being redirected...

[cruising7388]

Originally Posted by booster

Interesting, and a whole lot better than the old ones were!

I just went quickly through the e-trek and CS manuals. e-trek still says 1600AH of battery (not rated at 12v obviously), the CS says 190/380AH so must be at 12 volts. That would also indicate you can't get the 8 batteries in the CS, I think. Generator is listed for the CS. Run time on battery specs are non-existent and lots of warnings about using too much power from the AC, cooktop, oven, instant water heater. Glad to see they are more realistic of the real world. CS says not to run the AC while driving off the 2500 watt engine generator and inverter for very long, and not at all on propane while driving. e-trek says 6 year warranty covers batteries, but was a bit sketchy as to defining defective batteries down the road.

There was a section on charging that listed the 3500 watts from the engine generator, the charge from the shore power charger, the solar charger would all be available to charge, but I don't think they really would unless the charge voltages matched perfectly. Maybe I misunderstood how they stated it.

Seeing it all in one place about the e-trek and CS seems to confirm what appeared to be coming, mainly that even Roadtrek is backing of the air conditioning on batteries, as it was not really mentioned in the manual. Because of that, the e-trek would be a tough sell in hot areas, at least to us, as there is no way I would idle the van all day or night. With running the AC off batteries out of the picture, the CS really looks like a much better option with solar, propane generator, 380AH of batteries, and the 2500 watt engine generator, plus a better layout IMO. You could be off grid pretty much as long as you wanted, and had propane and tank space (plus some sun).

Glad to see that they are getting their literature in order, it has been a weak spot for a long time, and probably one of the biggest complaint areas on the Yahoo Roadtrek forum.

Whether one opts for the CS or the E-trek could depend upon on how many people you need to haul. If you need 4 sleeping spots plus more seating, the E-trek can support that. The CS can only sleep three and has less seating. IMO, you're spot on that if you don't need 4 sleeping spots, opting for the CS is a no brainer. It's got a better layout and a humongous two door refrigerator.

The CS can be ordered with 8 (1600 AH) lithiums. It's called a warp core option. However, it requires ordering the coach with the XL extended length option which ups the coach length nearly two feet. However, the additional length permits a total of 600 watts of solar and if desired the under chassis 30,000 BTU AC unit which, remarkably, operates off 12 volts.

I'm unaware that Roadtrek is downplaying running the AC from lithium batteries. The 210 with 800 ah lithium runs the AC unit for a long time without even kicking in the auto start feature. Just how long, I'll have the opportunity to quantify.

IMO, the weakest point is the Nations alternator which is rated at 280 amps but which apparently derates quite a bit when it runs hot. ARV has dropped the Nations alternator and is now installing a Delco 330 amp unit which runs substantially quieter with less derating when running hot. This unit costs easily double the cost of the Nations but in the context of the importance of the unit in the system, that's chump change.

Regarding the stacking of multiple charging sources - Roadtrek insists that the charging sources do stack but I can't find out how or where it's accomplished. However, it apparently can be and is done by ARV as Davyddd was able to determine empirically on his coach that multiple charging sources did indeed stack and produced additive charging. I was of the same opinion that you have that multiple charging sources would have to be identical in voltage and I was indeed able to replicate that conclusion experimentally. But what I didn't take into account was that I was looking at sources operating in the absorption mode which is voltage controlled. It turns out that if the charging sources are operating in the bulk charging current controlled mode, they apparently stack nicely even if the applied voltages are not idetical. And, at the point that the batteries are in the absorption stage, the diminished current requirement would make stacking multiple charging sources of little practical value anyway.

Your point regarding when a lithium battery is defective and subject to warranty replacement is an eye opener and it isn't just sketchy - it isn't even addressed, much less quantified. The pregnant question is: what level of AH degradation is required to qualify the battery as defective? Further, apparently not every supplier offers the same warranty. Two examples are GBS batteries built by Elite Power and installed by ARV and Roadtrek batteries. The warranties don't even faintly resemble one another. The Elite Power warranty is pretty comprehensive. By comparison, the Roadtrek warranty is cryptic.

Elite Power GBS Warranty: One year. (ARV most likely provides a longer warranty with different conditions)

This warranty does not cover defects resulting from improper installation, from abuse, misuse, misapplication, improper maintenance, neglect, alternation, accidents, casualties, fire, flood, collision, freezing, theft or other such as act of God.

The warranty will be void under the following conditions.
Apply voltage and current to Elite Power Solution's product beyond specified ranges.
Use chargers and/or BMS systems that are not provided or not approved by Elite Power Solutions.
Over-charge or under-discharge batteries beyond the specified voltage range during usage or storage. Batteries MERELY DISCHARGED are not considered defective.
Operate and store batteries in the temperature or humidity ranges outside of specified ranges.
Expose batteries under rain or under direct Sun light for extended period of time.
Product serial or date coding is removed, tampered with or destroyed.


Roadtrek Warranty: Six years

Warranty is voided if the EcoTrek batteries are tempered with, opened, or modified in any way, including attempts to change the Battery Management System programming or setpoints.

Warranty is voided if the EcoTrek batteries are allowed to remain in a discharged condition for extensive periods.

[avanti]

Originally Posted by cruising7388

Roadtrek Warranty: Six years

Warranty is voided if the EcoTrek batteries are tempered with, opened, or modified in any way, including attempts to change the Battery Management System programming or setpoints.

FWIW: The above warranty provision almost certainly violates the Magnuson Moss Warranty Act. They would have to prove that your "tempering" (sic) actually caused the failure, and the burden of proof is on them.

[gregmchugh]

This gets a little confusing when you resurrect posts from two years ago and discuss them in the context of the current electrical systems.

Roadtrek has recent added documents on their website in the owner's manual section that contain their most recent info for the Ecotreks, Voltstart, and Power Budget. Info is also in the owner's manuals for the specific models.

[booster]

Originally Posted by gregmchugh

This gets a little confusing when you resurrect posts from two years ago and discuss them in the context of the current electrical systems.

Roadtrek has recent added documents on their website in the owner's manual section that contain their most recent info for the Ecotreks, Voltstart, and Power Budget. Info is also in the owner's manuals for the specific models.

I was just going to say the same thing, as my post that was quoted was two years old, and lots of things have changed since then.

I think one thing that hasn't changed is that you have to be very careful with Roadtrek information, as lots of it has been somewhat confusing, misleading, or in error in the past.

[gregmchugh]

Originally Posted by booster

I think one thing that hasn't changed is that you have to be very careful with Roadtrek information, as lots of it has been somewhat confusing, misleading, or in error in the past.

And this continues to be a problem, we get regular reports of owners getting inconsistent info from Roadtrek employees but they are slowly documenting things in more detail which is a good move.

It is impossible to get accurate info on the new technology from the sales staff at the vast majority of the dealers, sales people at a few dealers know the details with accuracy. Roadtrek has been training service technicians onsite at some dealers and at the factory so they are getting the info out for service people but it has been slow.

[cruising7388]

Originally Posted by avanti

FWIW: The above warranty provision almost certainly violates the Magnuson Moss Warranty Act. They would have to prove that your "tempering" (sic) actually caused the failure, and the burden of proof is on them.

Ooops, sorry for the "tempering". It wasn't a copy and paste. I retyped it and of course my spell checker thought "tempering" was just fine. The actual word in the warranty is tampering.

With respect to the Magnuson Moss Act, do you know if there is language in the act that precludes the vendor from shifting the burden of proof as a condition of the sale? For example, I've seen sealing labels on equipment that indicate that simply breaking the seal voids any warranty independently of whether the equipment is subsequently modified. Can't such a disclaimer legally be a condition of the sale?

[cruising7388]

Originally Posted by gregmchugh

This gets a little confusing when you resurrect posts from two years ago and discuss them in the context of the current electrical systems.

Roadtrek has recent added documents on their website in the owner's manual section that contain their most recent info for the Ecotreks, Voltstart, and Power Budget. Info is also in the owner's manuals for the specific models.

I didn't resurrect the thread but I apologize for not noting that Wincrasher's post regarding the CS was a couple of years old. In any event, I believe that the lithium battery warranties I cited are still current.

[lani@poweroverhaul.com]

We just bought a new 2019 Roadtrek Simplicity SRT and even though the manuals and sticker list say a tankless HW Heater the dealership is saying we have a set-up with a tank? Was Roadtrek kicking out Simplicity's with both options? or is this dealership trying to pull a fast one on us?

[avanti]

Originally Posted by cruising7388

With respect to the Magnuson Moss Act, do you know if there is language in the act that precludes the vendor from shifting the burden of proof as a condition of the sale? For example, I've seen sealing labels on equipment that indicate that simply breaking the seal voids any warranty independently of whether the equipment is subsequently modified. Can't such a disclaimer legally be a condition of the sale?

Since this thread has been revived, I will answer the above question, which I missed at the time...

No, such disclaimers cannot be imposed as a condition of sale. MM makes them illegal, no matter what the manufacturer says. The Act trumps any attempts to circumvent it.

Interesting the you mentioned those "breaking seal voids warranty" stickers. About a year ago, the FTC explicitly declared such sticker illegal:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.15592119742c

[SteveJ]

Originally Posted by lani@poweroverhaul.com

We just bought a new 2019 Roadtrek Simplicity SRT and even though the manuals and sticker list say a tankless HW Heater the dealership is saying we have a set-up with a tank? Was Roadtrek kicking out Simplicity's with both options? or is this dealership trying to pull a fast one on us?

Be very glad that you did not get the tankless heater. They don't work well, especially in a boondocking situation when you're trying to conserve water.

On TDY near Central City, Colorado